Tess, radiation therapy (Tessie has passed)

[StarDeb55]

Dottie, in general, these labs are much improved compared to the weekend. Unfortunately, I still have a concern. The Na:K ratio (sodium/potassium) is not listed, so I calculated it myself. Right now, Tess' ratio is 24.2, definitely improved over the 20. something it was when she was at the ER clinic. This value still indicates a moderately severe electrolyte imbalance as normal range is 27.1-40.1. This may be an indication that the adrenal glands are still not producing enough cortisol or more importantly aldosterone to adequately control Tess' electrolyte balance. Please bring this to your vet's attention as I believe this still indicates that Tess has a certain degree of Addison's in play, not as much as over the weekend, but I feel there definitely could be a problem. At the first sign of any issue with Tess, even something as mild as slightly increased lethargy compared to the past couple of days, I would strongly encourage you to contact your vet.

Debbie

[Sammie]

Hey Dottie,

Thanks for the reply! You got it going on, girl...calling docs and asking questions then coming here and sharing with us what you have learned! I hope you understand that is what we are doing when we give you the information we have gleaned from living with Cushing's on a daily basis.

I am very glad to hear that someone is working on getting the UC Davis protocols included in the Trilo information. It certainly should be! That would help prevent some other pups from suffering what Tessie just went through!

Debbie will be along soon to give you her take on the labs, I'm sure. Thanks for posting them and the extra info she asked for. That really helps!
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls

Hugs right back at you Leslie. I am thinking you guys think I am mad at you and I am not. I think all of you are so cool to take the time to help me out. I would of never know about the information part of this website, because I am so worried about Tes. By all of you helping me to get the info I need NOW is so helpful then me surfing around for it. You have all helped me, and saver her life. If I could hug you all it still would not be a big enough THANK YOU to all of you. Please keep throwing it out there to me. I take it right back to my Vet. When he gives me the same answer as you or from Dr. Hoskins who is the top expert in this field. Still can't believe he picked up his phone LOL He was so cool and I went on and on for 20 min before he could say any thing LOL very nice man. He does know about your web site. I asked him LOL. Any way please don't take me mad at any one. Just worried and very direct. I am giving you all a big group hug I hope you can feel it. I do feel it from all of you Dottie

[frijole]

Dottie you made my day sharing that story of calling up Dr. Hoskins. That rocks!

We don't mean to hound you with questions and it is particularly hard with new members whose dogs are in distress. We get hundreds each year and it is like being a 911 operator sometimes. Typically a dog is in trouble the owner is following what they are told to do by someone (vet) who has never done it before. Owners know nothing about the disease and we brought in on the case when dogs are very sick and need immediate help. We have to be bold sometimes to make sure new members understand their dog's life is at stake. It can be scary and we do worry... alot.

You came on here not that long ago a "cushings virgin" but you are getting it! I will sleep better knowing that Tess' mom is on the case full time and asking questions and even calling a renowned specialist in the field to get the answers. Go girl go.

[Sammie]

Dottie, in general, these labs are much improved compared to the weekend. Unfortunately, I still have a concern. The Na:K ratio (sodiumotassium) is not listed, so I calculated it myself. Right now, Tess' ration is 24.2, definitely improved over the 20. something it was when she was at the ER clinic. This value still indicates a moderately severe electrolyte imbalance as normal range is 27.1-40.1. This may be an indication that the adrenal glands are still not producing enough cortisol or more importantly aldosterone to adequately control Tess' electrolyte balance. Please bring this to your vet's attention as I believe this still indicates that Tess has a certain degree of Addison's in play, not as much as over the weekend, but I feel there definitely could be a problem. At the first sign of any issue with Tess, even something as mild as slightly increased lethargy compared to the past couple of days, I would strongly encourage you to contact your vet.

Debbie

Debbie TY so much. The blood work he is running takes ten min. it is called a VETSCAN. It is not a full blood panel. I am running both panels on Monday. Yes later on today around 1:30 she looked lethargy, so I took her up and he ran this blood panel. At first he did not want to, because he did not want me spending the money. I joke around with him thats its toward his next VC. So because of this blood test she has to go back on Saturday. I was working Friday to Saturday, but now I have decided not to. My husband would be here while I would be gone, but I know Tes, she sleeps with me. I can see it on her face when something is up. So I was on the fence about it, but Debbie you have convince me. LOL Had I gone on my trip the night Tes really got sick, well she would of not been here. Not taking the chance now. My vet again said call him day or night at home if any thing looks weird. Told him I will never not call again. TY again Debbie for know how to translate the LAB work. Dr. Hoskins calculated Tessie 23 pounds to 10 mg of Vetoryl. Now how its done know clue. LOL I am a flight attendant. I can get you out of the aircraft in 90 sec or less LOL think the Hudson LOL that is what I say to PAX when they are talking during the safety video LOL I get a kick out of it LOL Dottie

[frijole]

To convert lbs to kg divide by 2.2

23 lbs divided by 2.2 = 10.45 kgs

[Sammie]

Hi frijole. I am trying to explain to my husband what I did today when i called Dr. Hoskins and how you think I rock LOL ty for that. OK here is one for you. I am a flight attendant who is on the know fly list. Now I have a ten year back ground check done on me every year, so ask how could I be on the know fly list. I don't have a strange last name. I got pist-off at BUSH and called the White House. Now I got the White House and spoke to one of Bush's internees that take complaints. I was a adult about it. Know cruising, Just the Facts mama Just the Facts. Well that got me on the list for the last 8 years to now. LOL I found this out a few months later, because my husband and I flew together some where, they stopped me, I had to go see a agent to have it fix and nothing to my husband, just me. LOL I think its kinda funny Dottie

[AlisonandMia]

The electrolyte imbalance is actually the most dangerous aspect of a Cushing's medication overdose (whether it be Trilostane (Vetoryl) or Lysodren). The reason it is so dangerous and potentially deadly is that for the nerves and muscles to work properly the electrolyte balance has to be correct. This means that the function of the heart can be affected and that is when it can get deadly.

As Debbie says it looks like Tess's adrenals are not at the moment producing enough aldosterone (which is the hormone that regulates the electrolytes). This means that she really needs to have the aldosterone production supplemented with a special medication called Florinef. (There is another medication that is used sometimes when the aldosterone production is known to be permanently reduced but is a long acting injection and when it isn't known whether the low level of aldosterone is permanent or not then Florinef (which is a daily pill) is often used at first.)

Maybe you can encourage your vet to talk to Dr. Hoskins (is he the specialist?) about Tess's electrolyte ratio and the possibility of supplementing her with Florinef. It should make her feel an awful lot better and will mean that she isn't at risk of a dangerous heart arrhythmia.

Your vet should be able to just check the electrolytes without necessarily running any other tests which should keep the costs down.

Alison

[Sammie]

To convert lbs to kg divide by 2.2

23 lbs divided by 2.2 = 10.45 kgs

Oh this is so cool I did it, it works. But is 10.45kgs also mgs?
Dottie

[Sammie]

The electrolyte imbalance is actually the most dangerous aspect of a Cushing's medication overdose (whether it be Trilostane (Vetoryl) or Lysodren). The reason it is so dangerous and potentially deadly is that for the nerves and muscles to work properly the electrolyte balance has to be correct. This means that the function of the heart can be affected and that is when it can get deadly.

As Debbie says it looks like Tess's adrenals are not at the moment producing enough aldosterone (which is the hormone that regulates the electrolytes). This means that she really needs to have the aldosterone production supplemented with a special medication called Florinef. (There is another medication that is used sometimes when the aldosterone production is known to be permanently reduced but is a long acting injection and when it isn't known whether the low level of aldosterone is permanent or not then Florinef (which is a daily pill) is often used at first.)

Maybe you can encourage your vet to talk to Dr. Hoskins (is he the specialist?) about Tess's electrolyte ratio and the possibility of supplementing her with Florinef. It should make her feel an awful lot better and will mean that she isn't at risk of a dangerous heart arrhythmia.

Your vet should be able to just check the electrolytes without necessarily running any other tests which should keep the costs down.

Alison

Hi Alison Dr Hoskins is the person who wrote the article posted on this website under resources:
Comparing therapies for canine hyperadrenocorticism
Oct 1, 2007
By: Johnny D. Hoskins, DVM, PhD, Dipl. ACVIM
DVM NEWSMAGAZINE

When I see my vet on Saturday I will talk to him about Florinef, but Dr Hoskins who I called today and my vet along with the UC Davis specialist are all saying just leave her alone. Give her nothing unless she stop's eating, gets really lethargic, ( which she is barking up a storm when the other dogs are barking) or she doesn't want water, but not wanting food is main one. I will ask him. I GOT INSURANCE ON TES. LOL very proud of my self. Saved money today. Dottie

[frijole]

Oh this is so cool I did it, it works. But is 10.45kgs also mgs?
Dottie

10.45 killograms equals 10,450,000 milligrams

http://www.ilpi.com/MSDS/ref/massunits.html

Usually the dogs weight is converted to kgs and the medicine dosage is in mgs. Is that where you were headed with this??

Regarding the no fly list... perhaps they overheard someone calling you a "terror" and thought they heard terrorist?

OK.. so according to our experts here the main thing we want to focus on for our Tess is the electrolytes. I had never heard of the Pedialyte stuff that Leslie mentioned either. But we have seen dogs' electrolytes improve simply by using it. Its cheaper than an IV! Just throwing it out as an idea should you need it. Kim