Morgan...Zombie Skin (CC): Need help w/ DMSO

[skinnybonedog]

Hi Everyone.....sad that I have to be here and have read so many of the "stories" here and some make me hopeful, some break my heart.
So my situation I hope involves iatrogenic hyperadrenocorticism. My 8 year old female French Bulldog has been on Temaril-P for years and I know the dangers of steroids but I thought that since it was such a low does it would not cause issues. She was put on it for chronic itchy skin. Well about a month ago she got into a fight with her sister and I thought she has gotten the skin on her shoulder pinched in the fight. But then about a week after it was not healing, and then got bigger and turned into a hard area about 2 inches in diameter. I was set to go on vacation with the dogs for a week and did that and it got worse. Was not able to get an appointment with my vet for 2 weeks and in that time it all got worse and came up on the other shoulder in the same place. My partner took her to the vet and he mentioned "CANCER" and/or possible issues from the long term steroid use. My hope is that this is Calcinosis brought on my the Temaril. I am tapering her off that and she is down to between 1/4 and 1/2 pill every other day in the am. Her energy is good, stools good, hair coat great except in the patches of what I am calling zombie skin. I have her on Cell Advance, melatonin, Adrenal jump start from Gaia herbs, Vetriscience BD, a liver support supplement, zinc, chia seeds and she is has been on a raw diet her whole life. I am devastated that I may have caused this and I should have known better. So my questions are what should my next step be? I am waiting for a call from the vet as he put her on antibiotics in hopes this was just a pyoderma infection but it is showing no change from that. Her next appointment is Monday. I am not even sure I should bother with a biopsy because it is pretty clear what this is (unless I am in denial and it is cancer). My hope is this was all caused by the Temaril and she will be ok, she is the most amazing dog. But I can't run any test until the steroid is completely out of her system right?? How long should that be after the last pill? And should I start DMSO on the zombie patches or just wait? There is no discharge, just torched looking, bumpy hard nodules. It does itch but does not seem painful and I put various things on it to help with the itch and her wash her in Duoxo every 3-4 days. Happy to have ya all to "talk to" about this. Thanks for any thoughts. I do not see a way to post an image unless it is already hosted....is that because I am new??

[labblab]

Hello and welcome! I just checked, and you are a fully registered member. Therefore, there shouldn't be any problem for you to create a personal photo album and upload pictures of your choice. Once you log in again, click on the "User CP" title on the upper left-hand corner of any page. That will take you to your control panel, and creation of a photo album will be one of the options available to you from the menu bar. Let us know if you continue to have problems, OK?

It doesn't sound as though your girl is exhibiting any other outward symptoms associated with Cushing's. So in terms of testing, probably the most useful thing would be to have a skin biopsy performed on one of the patches. We've been told that skin scrapings are not sufficient to diagnose Calcinosis Cutis -- that an actual punch biopsy is required. There would be no need to wait for a biopsy, if you choose to proceed. However, since you are already tapering your dog off the steroid, you may prefer to just give it some time in order to see whether the areas start healing now.

Since the skin issue is the only symptom consistent with Cushing's, I would not bother with specifically targeted blood testing. Even if she were to test positive for Iatrogenic Cushing's, your remedy would be unchanged: tapering her off the steroid. So let's first start off with taking a look at some photos of those lesions. Once again, let us know if you have trouble setting up your album.

Marianne

[labblab]

Oh good! I just your new photos of Morgan in your album. She sure is a beauty!

Now that you've got your album started, go ahead and take some photos of the lesions, OK?

Marianne

[skinnybonedog]

Here is my beautiful dog. I will take some shots of what I believe to be CC. I just talked to her vet and he said biopsy was next still leaning toward cancer. So I point blank repeated that the same thing is on both shoulders (but when he saw he, the right shoulder was way worse) and if it is bi-lateral and literally all appeared in the span of a month, did he still think cancer and he said no, most likely not. Said to keep her on the antibiotic until he sees her on Monday. Said he has not seen a case of CC in a dog on that low dose of steroid but is not saying it is not possible. I am thinking might be a good idea to catch her first pee Monday morning and take that with for a cortisol check or is that pointless given that she is still being tapered off the Temaril??

[labblab]

Hi again, for the reasons stated above, I really wouldn't bother with either blood or urine testing specific to Cushing's at the moment. The central issue is finding out the actual cellular nature of the lesions, so I'd be putting my money towards a biopsy.

Marianne

[skinnybonedog]

HI Marianne, I think our posts crossed. I was leaning as you said, just wait this out to see what happens when the Temaril is out of her system. The vet asked me how sure I was of "my diagnosis" and he was not being a jerk....I told him I had been doing alot of my own investigating and do not claim to be a vet but was a tech for a short time. He said he is just worried if I am wrong. I think he forgot she has an appt with him on Monday. So I told him he sees her Monday and he can decide what her things with how it looks now. Yes, will take photos of the lesions tonight. My wonderful Zombie girl....I just am so afraid I am in denial and the steroids are masking some other issues that I will find once they are stopped.

[skinnybonedog]

Ok, then I will have him do the biopsy because a confirmation of CC is better than worrying it could be cancer and I did not follow through. Does she have to be knocked out for the biopsy?

[labblab]

I'm sure the area would need to be numbed up, but I doubt that actual sedation would be necessary. But I truly don't know about that since I've not had that procedure done.

Depending on where you live, you might prefer to ask for a referral to a canine dermatologist. He/she would undoubtedly be able to give you a more educated guess just based on the appearance alone. Given Morgan's steroid history and the appearance of the lesions, they might not push for a biopsy.

But let us take a look at some photos, since we've seen quite a few cases here. We're definitely not vets, but we've probably "seen" more cases of CC than many actual vets have!

[skinnybonedog]

I am generally a cat person but this dog and stolen my heart 10 times over! I am obsessing over this whole thing. I am so sorry for those of you who have lost the battle with this condition/disease.

http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/pict...pictureid=8841

[labblab]

Trust me, I totally understand about obsessing!!!

We totally understand how worried you're feeling, and that's why I'm thinking a biopsy would give you the fastest, most accurate answer. But taking the time to see a dermatologist might give you some added peace of mind, just because he/she would know exactly which diagnostics are really necessary. But I realize a specialist may not be readily available to you.