Vaccine story

[addy]

We all have strong opinions regarding vaccinations. I have always believed in less is better. I distinctly remember a conversation with an old vet regarding my cat. She had been given every vaccination known to man on a regular basis because we had to board her at the vets for a few weeks a year for a stretch of time. During that time she was sick a lot. She had never been sick before or had so many vaccinations.

Finally, I remember having a strong opinion with her vet and I refused her annual vaccines, including the rabies shot. She was a house cat and only sat on her favorite cushion on a chair on the covered, raised outdoor balcony dressed in harness and leash . “Why” I asked, “does she need a rabies shot any more?”

He tried very hard to convince me “Well, a rabid bat could fly into your house.”

I laughed, “Oh come on, isn’t that a stretch? We live in an apartment!”

A few years later we move to an old historic building. We lived on the top floor and the old building overlooked a ravine and Lake Michigan. It had a lovely old sky light right outside our apartment door. We saw many critters in the yard, raccoons, even foxes.

Tinker loved to sneak out our apartment door and run up and down our third floor hall. It was a pain but since there were only 2 other apartments on that floor, no one really cared.

One day, we lugged our groceries up the three flights of stairs and of course as soon as we opened our apartment door, Tinker ran out and began her racing game up and down the hall. My husband happened to look up at the sky light, and low and behold, guess what was hanging there? A BAT!

Now I did consider calling the vet to apologize but changed my mind and said a verbal apology to the sky instead.

Thought I would share that true story

Addy

[AlisonandMia]

We, in Australia, don't have rabies BUT we do have something called Bat Lyssavirus which is so similar to rabies that the rabies vaccine is used to prevent it. So maybe we do, kind of, have rabies.

There was a tragic story a few years back when a fruit bat (large, fruit eating bat) gate crashed a BBQ and bit a young girl and a woman - absolutely not normal bat behavior at all! I don't know if the bat was caught and examined or not but anyway those bitten were offered prophylactic rabies vaccine. The parents of the child opted for it but the woman concerned decided she didn't want it. The child was fine but over a year later the woman died horribly of lyssavirus infection - it took that long before she became symptomatic. All bat carers, wildlife vets etc. are vaccinated for rabies.

I've never heard of any pets being infected via a sick bat but surely it could happen. If we have bats in the backyard at night, Zac is inside as we most certainly don't want him "playing" with them in any way either for their sake, his sake - or ours.

http://www.csiro.au/science/Australi...yssavirus.html

[labblab]

Addy, thanks for sharing your story. I don't know whether anyone else here is willing to admit that they also watch junky reality TV shows, but I do () and I think your story could be an advertisement for "Big Brother's" now infamous slogan: "Expect the unexpected..."!!!!!

But I surely understand why you never expected Tinker to be at risk. I don't even know whether or not rabies is very common in wildlife in Wisconsin. Unfortunately, here in Georgia, rabies is not unexpected at all. In the southeast we are experiencing a rabies epidemic in racoons, and other wildlife is affected as well. At the end of May, three dogs were attacked about 30 miles away from me by rabid raccoons in two separate incidents: two dogs were in their own yard, and one on the porch of its house. Our member Sue (also a Zoe's mom ) tells us that rabid raccoons have recently been trapped in her neighborhood in north Georgia. Also in May, two separate presumably rabid foxes attacked humans in broad daylight in metro Atlanta (I think film footage of one attack was aired by CNN). I guess the epidemic has been spreading up the east coast, because I recently read that visitors to Central Park in NYC are even being warned of rabid raccoons within the park!

We have raccoons all around us, and also some bats. My biggest scare has actually been in relation to a bat -- earlier this spring my two Labs were out in our fenced yard and I saw that they had cornered something. When I went out, it was an oddly-acting bat . Somehow I was able to get the dogs in the house, but when I went back out with a basket to try to contain the bat for Animal Control, it was gone.

It is due to these experiences that I may come across on the forum as being more proactive about pursuing vaccination for dogs who are stable enough to be candidates, and especially who spend time outdoors and live in areas of risk. But having said that, I truly do understand that in your own case -- the bat was a VERY unlikely and unexpected hazard for Tinker!

Marianne

[addy]

Hi Marianne,

I don't think you come on too strong about vaccinations. We all have our beliefs and opinions and a wise person can listen to other's ideas and beliefs and consider their options.

I like to keep an open mind. There is probably a good pun in the comment, but can't think of one.

I thought it was a good story to tell, and as you might have guessed, I love to tell stories.

Addy

[SasAndYunah]

The situation here in The Netherlands is almost simular to that in Australia. Rabies is one of several Lyssavirusses and that specific strain of Lyssavirus no longer excists here. But Lyssavirus 1 and Lyssavirus 2 (also known as Bat rabies) can be found in some of our more rare batspecies. However, the majority of the bat species we have here, don't carry either Lyssavirus 1 or Lyssavirus 2. So Yunah and I will sit and watch the bats as evening falls One of the largest bat colonies in this country is just one street away from me... But this is the species that doesn't carry either one of the Lyssavirusses.

The last outbreak of Rabies was in 1968 and I remember having our cat vaccinated But due to a thourough vaccination program for pets and due to "vaccinating" foxes by leaving "vaccinated" bait for them (20 pieces of vaccinated bait per square kilometer) rabies is now erredicated for over 40 years now. Just 5 miles east of me is the German border and they still have the occasional rabied fox. To prevent them from crossing the border, hunting or trapping foxes is not allowed. Because if you create space (in this case through hunting/trapping) that space will be taken in by other foxes and in our case most likely from Germany. By keeping the population up, the neighbouring German foxes won't enter this area

About vaccinating in general, I think it should be a decission made with common sense and with regard to the risks. My Boncuk had both epilepsy and Cushing's. My decission to be careful with vaccinations was, in all honesty, more based on his epilepsy then on his Cushing's. And based on the kind of dog he was, what he loved to do, how his life was... And he was a huge fan of water so I decided to have him vaccinated against a certain disease that is brought on by rat's pee, contaminating the water. I could have opted not to vaccinate him and not let him swim. But that would have been a decission for my personal comfort, without any regard of his love for water. And for me personally, there is one thing that counts the most (even over my comfort) and that is letting my dogs be dogs and enable them to do dogthings so they lead a full and happy doglife

On another note, in my many years of being involved with Turkish straydog rescue (a country that still has lots of rabies) all pups need to be vaccinated before they can travel to The Netherlands. And trust me, those pups are starved, covered in mange, fleas and ticks...so their general health is definately poor, but I never ever have heard of one single pup that died due to a rabies vaccination. And I am not saying it never happens, it probably will. I almost died due to some anti biotics I received but that doesn't mean that anti biotics are bad or dangerous. It happens...some react stronger then others. It's a risk we take just as we get into our cars everyday. But we can't dwell on all the risks we take when getting into our cars...life would be unbearable. So, my personal advice would be, inform yourself about risks, be sensible and don't panic from horrorstories. And put your dogs best interest ahead of anything else, including your own feelings

Saskia and Yunah

[addy]

Oh, you are so right about let a dog be a dog. I say that to my husband all the time. My biggest wish is to have a safe place to let my dogs off leash and just be dogs and not worry about everything, like coyotoes grabbing them or the two off them getting into things outside they should not eat or they just tried to eat a wasp or bee oh, gosh, the list goes on. I have seen them both get so sick from outside things but I don't want to wrap them in a bubble.

I am leaning toward the damage being greater to Zoe being put in quarantine from biting someone than the damage from the rabies shot, but I will discuss with her IMS next week.

Having said that, I still try to keep an open mind and listen to all of your opinons and experiences and then reweigh my thoughts and options. So many have valid points both ways.

I love a healthy debate!!!!!

We traveled to Amsterdam many years ago and visited outside of the city as well. We loved the city and countryside and the people were so very nice. We wished we had been able to see more and visit for a longer period of time.

Addy

[fluffmum]

We don't have Rabies here in the UK ,so no Rabies shots are needed.

Quite scary tho

Marilyn