Mira, 7yr old Husky - Cushings ruled out; liver cancer (Mira has passed)

My Mira... There is defintally something very wrong but she has almost none of the normal Cushings symptoms yet the vet says itcould be. She recommended I read up on it. I don't think she would say that unless she was very certain. All we are going on right now is the first blood test results. I would love your opinion! I will just note the Highs and lows.

ALK - 1282 (10-150) high
ALT- 110 (5-107) high
AST - 98 (5-55) high
CK- 469 (10-200) high

AMYLASE - 444 (450-1240) low

TV02 - 16 (17-24) low
CHLORIDE - 119 (105/115) high
POTASSIUM - 5.8 (4.0-5.6) high

NA/K RATIO - 26 (27-40) low

ABS NEUTROPHIL - 12551 (3000-11500) high

T4 was done too and came out normal. We are waiting on the urine test. Please tell me what you think so far. Thevet circled the first four in the list. I took Mira in thinking she has allergies and it was nobig deal but I wanted a blood test done just to check. She is coughingand gagging, panting some, has lost fur around her eyes andmouth, sleeping a lot, looks sleepy all the time, has constant discharge fromher eyes, is limping badly, can't really do walks. We had been walking every day up until a week ago. She suddenly wonteat dry food and she is begining to reject thecanned too now. She drinks the normal amount of water which is slightly more than she was. I think she has lost weight. I was brushing her tonight she go up and went to her pillow and peed on it. She is housebroken!! She is acting so strange. And I'm prone to panic. I don't want to loose her so soon.

Hello! I am so glad you've found us, although I am very sorry about the problems that Mira is having. From what you have posted so far, it does sound as though Mira exhibits some of the lab abnormalities and symptoms of Cushing's. However, other pieces do not fit very well into the "Cushing's puzzle." The first four lab values that your vet circled do correspond with Cushing's -- elevated liver enzymes and evidence of muscle wasting are consistent with abnormally high levels of circulating cortisol.

However, Mira exhibits other symtoms that I think may be consistent with Addison's Disease, which is the opposite problem from Cushing's (cortisol/aldosterone levels are too low instead of cortisol being too high). Read this description of the symptoms of Addison's:

Quote:

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Symptoms of Addison's disease are very similar to other diseases and they seem rather vague. Symptoms may include but are not limited too; middle age female dogs, usually over 7 years of age, depression, lethargy, weakness, not eating, weight loss, vomiting and diarrhea, drinking more, urinating more, dehydration, and a fast heart rate in some patients. Many times these symptoms may go unnoticed or correctly diagnosed and the patient finally presents in a Addisonian crisis. During an Addisonian crisis the patient may present in acute collapse and in shock. This is very serious, deadly, and scary to watch. Blood work will show low sodium level, high potassium level [the resulting Na:K ratio will be low], and high kidney enzymes...

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You can also read more about Addison's here:

http://www.peteducation.com/article....2+2097&aid=520

Many of these symptoms do sound like your description of Mira. However, apparently her kidney values still fall within the normal range? (BUN, CR or "creatinine"). Anyway, regardless of how her urine test turns out, I am thinking that an ACTH blood test may be the next best test for Mira because it can help diagnose either Cushing's or Addison's. Also, as you will see from reading more about Addison's, it is a treatable disease but can definitely turn life-threatening very quickly if it is not properly diagnosed and treated. If Mira seriously worsens in any way, I'd encourage you to take her back in to the vet immediately for emergency assessment.

Marianne

Gosh I hope I'm doing this right! I can't thank you enough for your imput and for taking the time to read my post so carefully. As I mentioned i am prone to panic. What might be something that would constitute an emergency? Probably not peeing in her pillow but I got to tell you that's all it took to get me here.

Yes, you are replying exactly right! :)

If Mira starts vomiting or suffering from diarrhea, or becomes even more lethargic or unresponsive -- I would call your vet and/oir take her right on in.

As I said above, the elevated liver values do correspond with Cushing's. Panting, muscle weakness and fur loss are also Cushing's symptoms. And sometimes Cushpups can appear to lose weight due to muscle wasting, even though their actual weight has increased.

But your description of Mira's behavior sounds "off" to me in other ways. The lack of appetite (as opposed to ravenous Cushing's appetite), the rather sudden onset of her lethargy and weakness (could walk up until a week ago), the gagging -- she sounds like something is more acutely wrong, whereas the progression of Cushing's symptoms tends to follow a slower chronic course. That is what is making me wonder what else might be causing her symptoms. When do you think your vet will have the results of the urine test?

Marianne

That's what I'm thinking, this testing is taking far too long... and yes this did happen suddenly. My dogs and i were running the streets two weeks ago with Mira right out front. Well really she's been acting strange for about a month. Oh I forgot to mention she has incontance (sp?) too.

The urine test results Might come in today the vet said. I'm very worried. What should I do?

Ok I'm panicing. I should mention other then the peeing in the pillow thing she had a pretty good night. Only coughed twice and she ate all her canned food last time pretty well and she's be a tad more active. Limping is very bad, seems to be just the front left leg. You can just look at her and tell something is wrong though. My husband thought she looked out of it sort of.

How long ago did your vet actually see Mira? Is he/she aware of these new issues with the picky appetite, lethargy and inappropriate urination? If not, I'd telephone the office to let your vet know what is going on. That way, your vet can help determine whether or not Mira needs to be seen again, regardless of whether or not the urine test results are back yet.

Marianne

Yes she knows about all the things I've mentioned. The blood was taken on the 28th of October. She called the next day and said we needed to rule out cushings. I think that's what your saying too. It didn't seem urgent to her. I talked to her again on Monday and told her of the new symptoms. The limping.

I just talked to the vet. We are going to the next step tomorrow. I'm really upset. She's thinking it might be something else too more serious. She said we wont get the result from this test until next Monday. If it's cushings she said with need to deside to treat or not. She'll die if we don't right?

Did your vet already have the results of the urine test, and is that why you are heading on to the next step?

Is your vet planning an ACTH test? This is a test that involves two separate blood samples drawn 1-2 hours apart. As I said earlier, this test can be used to diagnose both Cushing's and Addison's. Although if Mira's urine test (UC:CR) was abnormally high, that would already be consistent with a diagnosis of Cushing's rather than Addison's.

Actually, treatment for Addison's dogs is much more urgent than treatment for Cushing's. Cushing's is typically a slowly-progressing disease that is not urgently life-threatening. So you can take your time to learn more about the disease and the treatment options. However, if Mira seems to have something else going on, I'm assuming your vet will plan to proceed with some other diagnostics.

It will help us all a whole lot if you'll ask your vet for copies of any test results. That way, we'll be better prepared to help with suggestions and feedback. And one word of caution: an ACTH test can end up with a "false positive" result if a dog is suffering from an illness other than Cushing's at the time that the test is performed. So you may want to ask your vet about that issue tomorrow if the ACTH is indeed the test that she has in mind.

Here's a link to the index of our "Important Information" forum that has a ton of helpful resources about diagnostics and testing. I know it can look very overwhelming at first, but as you start to read through different articles, you'll be amazed at how quickly you'll starting picking up information.

http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=10

Marianne

Hi,

welcome from me as well :)

I don't want to confuse you but the symptoms you are describing would all fit Leishmaniosis. I'm not sure where you are located and if Leishmaniosis is pressent in your area but I sure would mention it to your vet.

Here's a case file with symptoms that the dog was presented with:
Client history

* Progressive weight loss despite normal appetite.
* Exercise intolerance/lethargy.
* Non-pruritic dermatitis that is unresponsive to conventional treatment.
* Stiffness/lameness.
* Chronic inflammatory eye disease including conjunctivitis .
* Polydipsia/polyuria.
* Vomiting .
* Diarrhea .
* Decreased appetite.
* Abdominal distension.


Here's a list of the symptomes:
Clinical signs

* Splenomegaly.
* Mild-moderate lymphadenopathy.
* Anemia .
* Exfoliative dermatitis, periocular alopecia and scaling.
* Ulcerative nodular dermatitis especially involving the nose, lips, eyelids, tips of the ears, tail and feet.
* Onychogryposis.
* Muscular atrophy.
* Ocular lesions:
o Keratitis.
o Uveitis.
o Chorioretinitis.
o Corneal edema.
o Glaucoma.
* Epistaxis.
* Polyarthritis - intermittent lameness.
* Pneumonia.
* Neurological abnormalities.

Here's a link about Leishmaniosis:
http://www.leishmaniasis.info/

You can see why the hairloss around the eyes and mouth, the constant discharge from her eyes, the lameness, lethargy, decreased appetite and even peeing would all fit?

So I would make sure you mention the possibility to your vet.

Best of luck,

Saskia and Yunah :)

Sorry I'm having trouble reading. We live in Orange Ca near Disneyland. In the city but I'll look into what your suggesting. Yes I believe the test your talking about is the one planned. Two differant tests done with something done in-between. To compare the differences. I will get copies of the urine test when I take her in tomorrow. I would behappy to pass that on to you. Maybe give me an email address and I'll send you scanned copies of the whole thing.

Hi and welcome to you and Mira! :)

Bless your heart! Man, can I relate to your fear! When my Squirt was first diagnosed, I was an absolute basket case. :eek: She is the light of my world and I cannot bear the thought of losing her. When her vet said "Cushing's", I could tell by the look on her face this wasn't the best of news and I broke down into tears right there in the exam room. For the next few months, I was overcome with grief, anger, fear, guilt, frustration, and confusion. My poor old mind just couldn't grasp anything except that my baby was sick! :(:eek::(

Nothing I read, nothing anyone said made any sense to me at all...it was all Greek! Even when they told me it would get better all I could think was, "Are you freakin' NUTS?!?! My baby is SICK with an incurable disease!!!! omg omg omg omg omg......" A dear friend here later described me as a woman who had stuck her finger in a light socket - hair standing on end! She kindly left out the lunatic rantings, the flying slobber and bulging eyes! :p Now, nearly 3 yrs later, I almost have the slobbering under control. :D

I know exactly how you feel, honey; many of us do. And, you are right where you are supposed to be; your reaction is completely normal. How else would a loving mother react to news that her baby may be facing some serious health issues? You're a good mom, as evidenced by your obvious love for Mira and your willingness to seek out help on her behalf. So, see? You are already ahead of the game and have a great foundation to build on! :)

Two things -
1) during this panic phase, try to take a few minutes to breath from time to time; just a few deep breaths, holding and slowly releasing - then you can resume "omg omg omg omg..." ;)

2) start your education. This is the most important thing you can do for Mira regardless of what the final diagnosis turns out to be. You are her first and last defense, her only voice, her advocate, and the more you know the stronger you will be in these roles. Get copies of all her test results and question the vet about anything you don't understand. Take notes during her exams, or take a tape recorder, or a friend so you can remember what was said. Start reading up on Cushing's here; our Helpful Resource section is full of good info. Go online and read about Addison's, which is, in very simple terms, the opposite of Cushing's. Then ask questions, lots of them. We will do our best to help you understand. Education is key and we are all here to learn and share. ;)

Last, but in no way least, know that you and Mira are not alone. We are here to help in any way we can. The collective experience found here is astounding and we are more than happy to share. When it comes to support...well, you couldn't have found a better place for good old-fashioned hand-holding. In fact, we have our own little looney bin here; all you gotta do is holler and I'll scoot over! :p;)

You're doing a good job, Mom! Keep your chin up!

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls :D - always

EDITED TO ADD LINKS:

http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/showthread.php?t=180

http://www.lbah.com/canine/cushings.htm

http://www.kateconnick.com/library/cushingsdisease.html

http://www.newmanveterinary.com/CushingDiag.html

ADDISON’S INFO:
http://www.addisondogs.com/

http://www.k9addisons.com/

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/addison_s_disease.html

http://www.vetinfo.com/canine-addiso...-symptoms.html

http://veterinarymedicine.dvm360.com.../detail/569664

http://veterinarynews.dvm360.com/dvm.../detail/574393

Hi and welcome to the forum.

I see that Marianne has given you some excellent information so I will try not to repeat her as I post my comments/observation. With respect to the hair loss around the eyes and mouth, this is not the normal pattern with cushing's. Dogs with cushing's will lose a lot of hair on their flanks, tail and torso, usually sparing all of the hair on the face and legs. A more likely cause for hair loss around the eyes and mouth, especially in a husky, is a condition called zinc responsive dermatosis. Huskies (Samoyed, Malamutes, American Eskimos and Siberians) are the only breeds that are predisposed to this condition. This is caused by low zinc levels, which can be caused by severe stress or the stress from any number of underlying illnesses. I came upon this information recently when doing research for my Pomeranian who was losing hair around her nose.

http://veterinarynews.dvm360.com/dvm.../detail/162405

Another more apt condition that causes hair loss around the eyes and nose is Demodicosis (demodex mange). This is a common problem in puppies and if it occurs in an adult dog, there is an underlying problem that is compromising the immune system. Cushing's is always a likely suspect.

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...ed=0CCAQ9QEwAg

I tend to agree with Marianne that symptoms and some of the laboratory abnormalities sound more like Addison's disease than cushing's. Coughing and gagging is not a common symptom associated with cushing's but it is in Addison's as some dogs present with secondary acquired megaesophagus (esophagus contractions). This condition shares a lot of the same blood abnormalities seen with endocrine disorders, including elevated liver enzymes.

I think Mira has a lot going on and given her symptoms and lab abnormalities, I personally think an internal medicine specialist is a lot better equipped to diagnose and treat Mira than a general practitioner. That is not to say that your gp vets isn't great but when you are dealing with autoimmune issues and endocrine disorders, you definitely want the extensive education,training and experience of an internal medicine specialist.

If you are unaware of any specialists in your area, you can try to locate one near you on the acvim website (see link below). If you let us know what city and state you are in or near, members might be able to provide you with a name. Many members' dogs, including my two cushdogs, are treating exclusively with internal medicine specialists.

http://www.acvim.org/websites/acvim/index.php?p=3

Glynda

In the time it took me to type my prior post, in between disruptions at work, I see that you live in Anaheim. My dogs treat with VCA All Care Animal Referral Hospital in Fountain Valley. I am 50 miles from there but don't mind driving an hour because I know my dogs are getting the best care. They are also open 24/7 so weekend appointments are easy. Dr. Michael Moore is the Director of Internal Medicine and is an excellent doctor, as is Dr. Alyssa Mourning. My dogs have treated with both.

http://www.acarc.com/

Squirt - thank you yes that discribes me pretty well too. Sitting here not knowing terrified that at any moment she may fall dead and feeling my reaction to it. Will she start having seisures? What if she started screaming in pain, I'd start screaming too. Im so on edge. The sound of a hurt dog just kills me. I hate the places who send pictures of starving and hurt dogs. I don't donate to them because i can't bare to see the pictures. But I do donate a lot to the protection of animals. Mainly dogs. I'm very shy and rather a hermit but I'll talk to a dog passing by so easily.

We have had dogs since 1978. All pure breed Siberian Huskies. Five of them. We have have Kira and Mira right now. Kira is 10 she just had TTA surgery on both knees. In 2008 and six months ago. My Kira walks, no more limping! Cost us $6,000. Mira just got over seperation anxiety a year ago. She had broken out of windows twice I couldn't leave her alone in the house. But now she does it just fine and now we are loosing her.

When Mira first started acting funny I started searching the symptoms. I ran into Cushing's and read quite a bit then. But I didn't think it was that bad I thought more like allergies. When the vet first saw her Cushing's was not on her mind either I don't think. When she said we must rule out Cushing's I went searching everywhere including here! I also did my best to disifer the blood test. I'm not seeing Cushing's there so much. I'm seeing liver damage and more likely Addison's then Cushing's. And the electrolytes imbalance said it could easily be life threatening. Im seeing far worse then Cushings! But what do I know. I study this stuff hour after hour. It's all I do I can do nothing else. But cry. The only slight relief I got was here. Here you say Cushing's can be handled. But Mira? She has more. I desperately wanted someone else to look at the blood test. Here I notice you guys wanting blood test numbers, asking for that repeatly. But nobodys matched Mira's. But I thought you guys would know. So I joined. I was excepted at lighting speed and had an answer within the hour! And someone to talk to. Gosh you guys are wonderful.

What's bothering me now is not knowing. The vet says it might be more serious. I agree but what? Will Mira still be here in two weeks? Two days? How many times am I going to panic? I slept on the edge of the bed with one hand on Mira laying on the floor. She follows me everywhere she is the head of "mommies fan club" and the "welcoming comitie." she makes me feel needed and important.

Today I have started taking notes of everything she does. My memory is not good. I don't read or learn easily. But I do have determination. My dogs are my life. We have no children by choice. I love my husband of 32 years but my dogs are my children I can't live without. They are provided for in my will. Siberain Huskies. I fell in love with them the first time I saw one.

Lulu - thank you yes I saw the thing about zinc and I bought a big bag of Taste of the Wild Salmon. Which was said to be high in zinc. But Mira won't eat it. She did at first. But not enough tohelp. That condition hasn't gotten any worse or any better. She's been pawing at her face. I have to tell her not to scratch it. But it is bothering her. Thank you for bringing it up I did mention the zinc thing to the vet.

Internal med. Ok that's a good place for second opinion? I have been considering an advanced critical care place but their reviews arent the best. I want the best place possible near me. I don't care about the cost. Well I do but you know what I mean. Does anyone know of a place near Orange Califorina?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lulusmom

In the time it took me to type my prior post, in between disruptions at work, I see that you live in Anaheim. My dogs treat with VCA All Care Animal Referral Hospital in Fountain Valley. I am 50 miles from there but don't mind driving an hour because I know my dogs are getting the best care. They are also open 24/7 so weekend appointments are easy. Dr. Michael Moore is the Director of Internal Medicine and is an excellent doctor, as is Dr. Alyssa Mourning. My dogs have treated with both.

http://www.acarc.com/

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Oh my gosh thank you for that!!! I was answering one post at a time and hadn't seen this yet! Thank you so much for the recommendation it's likely all of fifteen miles from me. And 24 hours too! Stuff always happens after the vet is closed. I never know who to trust.

I just wanted to mention that VCA All Care is an excellent critical care hospital with round the clock care and very liberal visiting hours. In addition to a great internal medicine department, they have an excellent oncology department as well as an excellent orthopedic department. About the only thing they don't have there is eye care.

Glynda

I just looked into VCA. Ratings are pretty scary. They either get a 1 or a 5 it seems. Seems to be more 1's. You either love them or you hate them. Do you have appointments when you go? Do you have to wait past your appointment time? Have you every left your dog there? I hate leaving them at the vets. Mira by the way has a history of SCREAMING the most god awful sound you every heard. I thought she was dying the first time I heard it. It even scared the vet. She always screamed. The girl at the desk says Mira is betting up the our tech! And I'm certian she was. We get her out of the officeand she's fine. We had an emergency out of town a vet took her in back. Came back and said she won't let me touch her. I know you'll haveto put her out. She isn't biting she's just screaming truly terrified. I swear I don't bet my dog I swear! We changed vets three years ago. She screamed the first time but never again after that. We have two dogs so they always have each other. Mira has to spend the morning at the vets tomorrow. I think I'll ask if Kira can stay with her.

I think you will find that any vet you search on the internet is that way. Have to figure that the folks who are unhappy or angry are more likely to go on and post a comment than the ones who are satisfied and happy.

I can't vouch for that particular clinic so don't take this as a recommendation - I just know that I have stopped using online resources to judge a vet clinic because they make them all sound bad and I know from some experience that a lot of people may be confused about what happened to their pets too.

I'd take Glynda's recommendation in a heart beat if I was looking for a vet. Wish she could recommend one for me up north!

Natalie

Quote:

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Originally Posted by k9diabetes

I think you will find that any vet you search on the internet is that way. Have to figure that the folks who are unhappy or angry are more likely to go on and post a comment than the ones who are satisfied and happy.

I can't vouch for that particular clinic so don't take this as a recommendation - I just know that I have stopped using online resources to judge a vet clinic because they make them all sound bad and I know from some experience that a lot of people may be confused about what happened to their pets too.

I'd take Glynda's recommendation in a heart beat if I was looking for a vet. Wish she could recommend one for me up north!

Natalie

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Natalie. Thank you for that. I need to be braver I know. It's Dutifully noted and taken to heart. :-)

Glynda - thanks for the link to the Zinc report. I missed this web page in my search. That's got to be it around her eyes, it looks just like the picture except Mira's is not as bad and is not raw looking. That could be because I don't let her scratch her face just for that reason. She has scratched it raw in the past. She does not have the fur loss that is realted to cushings. I will pass this on to the vet.

The megaesophagus thing I don't understand it too well. Does this have anything to do with when a dog pulls to much when being walked and they cough? I have huskies ... All they do is pull, even with spike collars! I never could get a husky not to pull!

Janis-Altira

Help! I can see my dogs heart pounding in her chest. She is breath quietly but fast.

A fast heart rate is one of the symptoms that is listed for Addison's Disease. Definitely ask your vet about the possibility of Addison's when you take Mira in today, OK? You can tell her that in the process of researching Cushing's, you've discovered that Mira also has a lot of the symptoms of Addison's Disease.

Marianne

Is 98 bpm fast? I'm feeling the heart itself. She doesnt seem stressed. My other husky I can't find a pulse at all anywhere. Thigh or behind front left leg. Bless you for being here!!!

I am taking a copy of your first two posts with me to the vets in about four hours. She gets to see the regular vet this time. I watch my dogs breathing all the time. It's always slow and gentle when rest. I've never seen the heart pounding in the chest before. It looked shaky. This will be at the top of my list!

Wanted to let you know that I've sent you a Private Message (PM) with info about sending us scanned copies of Mira's lab results. The fastest way to get to your private mailbox is to click on the link that is right below your username up in the upper right-hand corner of every page. ;)

Marianne

I wasn't quite sure how Addison's (Hypoadrenocorticism) causes Megaesophagus so I looked it up. Here is a little blurb I found as to the cause of acquired Megaesophagus:

Quote:

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The most common endocrine diseases associated with megaesophagus are hypoadrenocorticism and, possibly, hypothyroidism. With hypoadrenocorticism, it is suspected that megaesophagus results from impairment of muscle carbohydrate metabolism due to glucocorticoid insufficiency. In addition, depleted muscle glycogen stores and decreased catecholamine activity may play a role. In one case report, atypical Addison’s disease was diagnosed and subsequent therapy with prednisone resolved the megaesophagus.

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Will be waiting for an update after your appointment with the vet.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by k9diabetes

I think you will find that any vet you search on the internet is that way. Have to figure that the folks who are unhappy or angry are more likely to go on and post a comment than the ones who are satisfied and happy.

I can't vouch for that particular clinic so don't take this as a recommendation - I just know that I have stopped using online resources to judge a vet clinic because they make them all sound bad and I know from some experience that a lot of people may be confused about what happened to their pets too.

I'd take Glynda's recommendation in a heart beat if I was looking for a vet. Wish she could recommend one for me up north!

Natalie

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In my experience with using online reviews for vets, the specialty clinics, who understandably charge more for services, make people very unhappy when they get the bill. I ignore those reviews.

Urine Test Results:
Cortisol 25.2
Creatinine 66.2
Cortisol/Creat Ratio 119

It's all greek to me on this one. Vet said it did not rule out cushing's. Love to hear your comments.

Mira is at the vets having the next blood test. Kira is keeping her company. I didn't get to talk to the vet and I may not get to when I pick her up either. I left him a bunch of stuff about what was said here and about that weird heart thing last night.

Janis

My brother, who has been a medical doctor (internal medicine) for a very long time looked at the two test results. He says it's not Cushing's or Addison's. He says it's an infection of the gallbatter. He wants me to get a liver ultrasound pronto. I will do that first thing tomorrow. If I live through the night! This pounding heart thing she's having scares the he'll out of me. Luckily it doesn't seem to bother her.

Only got a minute to post here but you are going to cancel the testing scheduled for tomorrow? Sounds like it was to be the Low Dose Dexamethasone Test (if it was to take all day/8 hours). If Mira is sick already (and it sounds completely consistent with a glugged up and/or infected gallbladder) and especially if she gets stressed out at the vets then it is almost certain that she will test "positive" for Cushing's on that test - even though she almost certainly doesn't have Cushing's.

Although Cushing's typically increases ALP (sometimes ALT is a little elevated too) the elevations in the other enzymes suggest very strongly that something else is going on.

I agree an ultrasound sounds like it is in order. You may find you need to be referred to specialist or university facility for this. Most vets' ultrasound machines are not at all high resolution and for complex diagnoses a high resolution machine is necessary - and the opinion of someone very practiced in reading u/s scans is good to have too.

Good luck and keep us posted.

Alison

I swear I detect ANGELS floating around this forum in the form of Members and Administrators!

I have already talked to a place near by that says they can do the ultrasound no problem. And they will be happy to use the test results that were just done. Critical Care place with all capabilities you can imagine. Our Kodi had a MRI done there. Our Kira had TTA knee surgery done in the same complex. It's very expensive but that's ok. Thanks ever so much for telling me you agree with my brother!

I am glad you have somewhere state-of-the-art to go for the ultrasound.

I think gallbladder problems are a distinct possibility although how that would be connected to lameness I'm not sure, nor the coughing and sneezing and heart pounding you are seeing. (We've seen more than a few gallbladder dogs here and I've never heard of those symptoms.) I'm wondering if she hasn't got some sort of unusual infection - maybe something insect or tick-born as Saskia suggested? If it was my dog I would certainly be wanting to have an u/s done as the next step - those liver numbers mean that the liver, gallbladder and pancreas need to be checked out.

If nothing really conclusive comes up in the u/s (like an inflamed and heavily sludged-up gallbladder) I would think that getting into an IMS vet as Glynda suggested would be a very, very good idea. Probably wouldn't be a bad move even if the gallbladder does turn out to be the problem and the only problem.

It sounds like something fairly complex could be at play here and an IMS is best placed to help - and will almost certainly work out cheaper in the long run.

Alison

PS: The reason that people wondered about Addison's was the low sodium/potassium ratio. I presume Mira isn't on any medications? What sort of food does she eat? Is it possible she could have eaten something something she shouldn't have - like someone's medication?

"AlisonandMia; I am glad you have somewhere state-of-the-art to go for the ultrasound.
I think gallbladder problems are a distinct possibility although how that would be connected to lameness I'm not sure,"

Well we were running the streets recently she could have pulled something. It's just one leg.

"nor the coughing and sneezing"

She's been coughing and gagging. At the same time. I saw a video of a dog siad to have Kennel Cough. It looks exactly like that. I mentioned that to the vet and she agreed it could be but never went anywhere with it. She (they) are more concerned with the cushings thing.


"and heart pounding you are seeing."

That one has really got me. Even now her pulse is 98 bpm. Our other husky is at 50 bpm. Mira's breathing is twice as fast too. 40 vs 20. My brother said this was happening becasue she is sick. And is likely not good. Good resaon to rush.


"(We've seen more than a few gallbladder dogs here and I've never heard of those symptoms.)"

Maybe they aren't related, that's what the vet is saying about the cough and the limp anyway. I'm also certain she has this Zinc problem too. Thats a lot of stuff to have not related. A lot of stuff to happen all at once. Maybe she lacks the ability to fight stuff off.

I admit none of her symtoms point to gallbladder problems. Jondice (sp?) and whatever the others were I forget. My brother, I don't recall if I sent him my symptoms list. But I don't think he mentioned them. He's just desifering the blood and urine tests. And said this is the best way to go. The liver ultrasound. Everything points more to the liver then anything else and I agree.

"If it was my dog I would certainly be wanting to have an u/s done as the next step - those liver numbers mean that the liver, gallbladder and pancreas need to be checked out."

Yes I will be asking to have eveything possible looked at. Pancreas is mentioned a lot.


"If nothing really conclusive comes up in the u/s (like an inflamed and heavily sludged-up gallbladder) I would think that getting into an IMS vet as Glynda suggested would be a very, very good idea. Probably wouldn't be a bad move even if the gallbladder does turn out to be the problem and the only problem.
It sounds like something fairly complex could be at play here and an IMS is best placed to help - and will almost certainly work out cheaper in the long run.
Alison
PS: The reason that people wondered about Addison's was the low sodium/potassium ratio. I presume Mira isn't on any medications?"

She was taking Predisone which we know can trigger cushings but it's been over a year and she only took it for a week or two for itchy skin. I gave her Dasuquin very recently cus Kira was taking it. For maybe two weeks. But I stopped. Too expensive. It's my understanding that is harmless.

"What sort of food does she eat?"

Science Diet Light canned and dry mixed with lots of water cus she had anal sac problems from not drinking enough water.

"Is it possible she could have eaten something something she shouldn't have - "

That IS very possible. Mira eats odd things. She loves kleenex and paper towels. And manages to get into the trash for it often. In my sewing room she loves to eat tiny scrapes of fabric that falls on the floor. I told the vet about that too. The coughing I have wondered if something is stuck in her throat. But I thought the vet would deduce that. Obstruction I wouldn't rule that out.


"like someone's medication?

Now that one is really frightening becase I was throwing out old doggie medicain about a month ago and she did get into the trash at that time. The meds where at least twenty years old. But I would think the reaction would have been dire right away. Don't you think? I have no idea what they were. I could go through old records I guess.


"I'm wondering if she hasn't got some sort of unusual infection - maybe something insect or tick-born as Saskia suggested?"

Got this from the link:"A few years ago, canine leishmaniasis was discovered in hunting packs of fox hounds in many States in the USA (but none west of Kansas)."

We are in Southern California, we just don't have that many odd insects around here. When we go on outings it's to the desert. We have been to the colorado river which was said to have some sort of weird organizim in the river water. We were there 6 weeks ago. I think if she had that she would be dead though. But I'll keep that in mind. It killed a human child who had been swiming underwater.

Heart Worms keep crossing my path. If it was that wouldn't it stand out?

Janis

Mira is flooped over on her back. Sleeping. Belly up at the moment. Always nice to see that!!!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTowgsSUCww

Heartworm could be a possibility - I gather it can affect the liver. A quick, simple in-house blood test can diagnose.

Apparently since Katrina, which resulted in many dogs being relocated throughout the US from heart-worm infested New Orleans, heartworm has been popping up in places where it was previously unknown.:(

I'd get that possibility checked out ASAP!

Alison

I'm going now. I have a whole page of notes.

Mira has liver cancer. Big masses.