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Hi Vicki,
I hate to hear that our Scoop seems to be developing another issue. :( It's good that the vet isn't wanting to wait any longer, tho, and is ready to take some action to help him. Sometimes you would swear that these little ones lie awake at night thinking up ways to drive us buggy! :D Let us know what the vet decides.
Hugs,
Leslie and the gang
Leslie-Thanks. I have to wait for the vet to call me when they get the culture plates in. Hopefully that won't be too long. I agree with the ways to drive us buggy thing. It is just one thing after another with Scoop.
Hey Trish-I wish it was as easy as saying "be gone". I would also say that to the nasty tumor. I take Amlodipine for my blood pressure. It must work. I went to the doctor the other week for a BP check and to my surprise it was pretty good. With all the stress I have with Scoop's problems I thought it would have been through the roof.
Hey Vicki
How are you and Scoop today?
Mel and Tia xxx
Hi Mel, Things are about the same with Scoop today. Last night he was trying to hump Raleigh but at least it didn't last very long and it's not a regular daily thing. He also, around the same time, seemed like he wanted to throw up but nothing came out. Did that 3 times. We were just outside. Scoop had a very soft poop and he's had pretty much gas today. All of his poops have been softer on the g/d food then it was on the w/d food and the w/d has more fiber. He is right here with me and he is trembling like crazy. Me, all my days are the same, worry, worry, worry, cry.
Scoop just got up, went into the dining room, walked into the table leg and almost fell over. I feel so bad for him. Wish he could see.
The vet's office called today. They got the culture plates in. If I would have my car I could have taken him in for the urine culture and BP check. My husband had to use my car today. I'm going to try to get Scoop there tomorrow. Since the culture has to sit for 72 hours, tomorrow would be good. Then it can sit over the weekend.
Hope you are having a peaceful day.
Big hugs
Thinking of you. Good luck with Scoops visit. Let us know how you get on
Mel and Tia xxx
Does anyone have their babies on low dose aspirin? Scoop's vet called at supper time yesterday and threw so many things at me. I feel like my head is spinning when I get done talking to her. I feel so anxious or something after we talk. She didn't explain why she's putting him on the aspirin. I guess it's for the heart? She said his dose is so low that it has to be compounded. He will be getting meds when we go there today. She said they will help his kidneys and his blood pressure.
Hey Vicki
I have very limited knowledge with the medicine side.
Could you write down a few questions before you go to ask the nice vet so you can understand why they have recommended these next steps. Might make you feel better
Hope it all goes ok, big hug from me, hang in there
Mel and Tia x x
I had asked the vet the other day about getting a prescription sent to Drs. Foster and Smith for Scoop's Vetroyl. Yesterday she told me she looked at it on line and she said it looks like the same thing but you can never be sure. She said something about some places getting meds being made in Mexico and you can't be sure about what you are getting. She said they know for sure who they deal with and they know they are getting the right thing. Now she has me scared to order anything from anywhere except from the vet's office. Boy, as if I don't have enough to worry about. Everything is so upsetting and frustrating. I don't want to do anything to hurt Scoop but the vet's products are so darn expensive. Right now I am so frazzled.
Mel, I try to have questions written down when I go. I don't know if I will get to talk to the vet when we go today unless they are going to charge me for an office visit. They will probably just take Scoop in the back and leave me out front while they do the tests. Scoop's regular vet has off today so a different one will be doing the tests. She does know pretty much what is going on with him. He has seen her a couple of times since the summer. She used to be his regular vet before he started with diabetes. Right around that time she left to have a baby so we started seeing the one he usually sees now. I'll post Scoop's BP numbers tonight, if I don't fall asleep first.
I do want to find out what the next step will be after the results of the culture are known. Will she keep trying to find out the reason for the protein in the urine or just keep treating with the meds. I do know in a week after he starts the meds he has to have a blood test done.
Poor you and Scoop. ((hugs))
I think a lot of people here have had the vetoryl comounded at Diamondback and have been pleased with the results. I don't think the vets can dare totally sign off on it just in case, does that make sense.
I usually have no knowledge to share with you but I am always rooting for you and Scoop. Judi
Sometimes it seems like one thing after another. Surely they shouldn't charge to give an update on a condition you have paid the consultation fee on!
Wish I had magic words to help but know that you and little Scoop are in my thoughts, hoping for an informative, uneventful vet visit
Mel and Tia xxx
Scoop had another one of his "episodes" last night. After he ate his supper he got all antsy. I took him out. When we came in he seemed to be looking for Raleigh but can't be positive. He seemed to be a little horny. He just kept wondering and you can hear his nose going. He walked around in cicles about 3 times in the kitchen. Soon after that it seemed like he wanted to throw up but didn't. More walking around. Threw up a very little bit of his supper. Still unsettled. Threw up again. This time it was a little pile of food. He seemed to calm down some after that but it took a little awhile. After that when he would exhale I could hear him. It was on the loud side and everytime he exhaled his body would shake. His tummy was gurgling too after he settled down.
Thanks Judi
I had called the compounding pharmacy(the one where the aspirin will come from and Scoop had antibiotics from there too) that is about 15 minutes from my house about Trilostane. It is so reasonable compared to Vetoryl. I just don't know if it would be good to switch him from Vetoryl. It could have a different affect on him, right? Maybe it's something else to ask the vet about.
Thanks Mel
Sorry Scoop is doing it tough, I know it is very hard to know which way to turn, might be worth mentioning the sickness again when you go in again today wouldn't want them to give you anything to aggravate the problem
Xxxx
Hi Vicki,
I'm so sorry that Scoop is having such a hard time but I want you to sit down 'cause I'm gonna talk to you like your mom. :D
You really, really, really, really need to take Scoop to see an IMS - or at least get second opinion from another GP vet in a different clinic because Scoop's current vet is sadly failing him, and you both are suffering as a result. :(:(:( It is difficult for us to "see" him struggling and I can only imagine how hard it is on you and your family to see it IRL. I beg you, for Scoop's sake, take him to see another vet - preferably an IMS. You have said that your husband didn't think a new vet was necessary and you didn't want "to rock the boat". Sweetheart, it's time to SWAMP that boat! :eek::D
Scoop's case is complicated and needs new eyes to look at it. It may be that a second opinion would agree with exactly what is being done for him now....but what if there is a much better approach that would bring Scoop, and you, some much needed relief? I personally think it is grossly unfair for anyone, including your hubby, to stand in the way of Scoop getting the best care you can provide. :(;) I do NOT want you to be hurt, physically or emotionally, and if that is the type of situation you live with, then we will all have to bite the bullet and simply pray Scoop doesn't suffer too much. But if you have no concerns of being abused yourself, please get a second opinion for Scoop. ;) We want the best for you and for Scoop...and I'm just not sure that Scoop is getting the best from his current vet. YOU deserve better treatment than what you have described from this vet. ;)
Hugs,
Leslie and the gang
Leslie-Thank you for caring so much. It makes me feel good to know how much everyone cares. I DO NOT worry about physical abuse, not at all! Really, my husband has always been very good to me. I have always been the kind of person who is afraid to open my mouth. That's my problem. I know he knows this is hard on me but I'm not sure if he knows just how hard. I would like to talk to you more. I don't have time right now. I will talk to you later tonight if I don't fall asleep, which happens to me sometimes.
I do appreciate everything you said.
Thanks for caring about Scoop and me.
I love you guys.
Hi Vicki,
I had written a long post and it got lost in the internets space/time thingee.
So I'll start again. Vetroyl and Trilostane are the same thing, Trilostane is the ingredient in Vetroyl. Dechra though makes vetroly and the FDA says that only they can made certain dosages. You can get Vetroyl in 30, or get Trilostane compounded at 31mg. You see where I'm going with this? So no need to worry on that front. If you have used the compound pharmacy near you and feel good with them, and need to cut costs, I'd go with the Trilostane, if you can afford the vetroyl, then that is where you should stay. It's up to you. Diamondback IS one of the compounding pharmacies that many here have used to complete satisfaction. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend them.
Now, what Leslie said, absolutely, you need a completely different plan and that should include an IMS as your primary physician for Scoop. He has way too many issues, I don't care how good a vet yours might be. She isn't a specialist and that is what you need, on the case, all the time.
You can do this Vicki, you are stronger than you know.
hugs,
Sharlene and Molly Muffin
Thinking of you
Xx
Hey Vicki, I so understand some of your stuff with the hubby and your fur baby...Get your voice heard, thats what I did for my Simba...I changed vets, found this group and got strength from knowledge and so much encouragement too. My hubby says, Simba is just a dog, but to me he's my best friend and I will do what I can to make his life better. Happy Simba = Happy Mama = Happy Hubby!!!!!! Hang in there!
Pfffttt Just a dog. Mine tries that and he might find that he is Just a husband.:D:D:D:D He might find that the next time he's on the couch with a cold but can't seem to move to get himself anything...Just a hubs, just a cold, you'll live, moving on.
Of course he wouldn't but I totally sympathize with how hard it can be to make others understand how much we love our babies and how important they are in our lives.
Sharlene and Molly Muffin
Hey Sharlene, you are hilarious, see this site gives us smiles too!!!
Hey Vicki
Just wondering how you and Scoop are doing and how you got on yesterday?
Mel and Tia
Xxxxx
Vicki, this excerpt discusses low dose aspirin therapy and I have come across that therapy in other articles as well. This excerpt may be rather hard perhaps for us lay people to understand but I copied it for you to read.
When protein is found in the urine, depending on other serum and urine values, a vet will decide to monitor, then investigate to find the cause of the protein loss, is it renal or from a potentailly treatable underlying disease and then intervene if it is persistent proteinuria. Is Scoops serum (blood) albumin also elevated?
Hang in there sweetie, we are here for you.Quote:
There are 6 basic principles to therapy in glomerulonephropathies: 1) If a cause of immune-complex disease can be identified, it should be treated. 2) Manifestations of the nephrotic syndrome, if present, should be managed with dietary salt restriction and judicious use of diuretics. 3) Antithrombotics (eg, aspirin) should be considered for hypoalbuminemic (plasma albumin <1.0 g/dL) animals as well as those with low serum levels of antithrombin III (<30% of normal). In dogs with marked proteinuria and serum albumin <2 g/dL, low-dose aspirin therapy is appropriate, unless melena is present or gastric ulceration is suspected. However, aspirin is bound to plasma proteins and is eliminated via the kidneys, so the dosage may need to be adjusted. 4) Because proteinuria may promote interstitial fibrosis, treatment to limit glomerular loss of protein is warranted and may include dietary protein restriction and administration of an ACE inhibitor. 5) Efforts to reduce the magnitude and consequences of glomerular immune complex deposition should be considered, especially in animals with biopsy-confirmed glomerular inflammation and no known primary antigenic stimulus. Immunosuppressive drugs (eg, azathioprine, cyclophosphamide, cyclosporine) can be used in dogs with glomerulonephritis, although results are variable. For amyloidosis, dimethylsulfoxide and colchicine have been tried, but without consistent results. These anti-inflammatory drugs should be administered only on a trial basis with owner consent. Corticosteroids seem to be beneficial only in mild glomerulopathy; they may worsen proteinuria in other glomerulopathies and should be avoided in animals with amyloidosis, as they are reported to enhance amyloid deposition. 6) Manifestations of chronic kidney disease will be observed in accordance with the stage of disease. Appropriate therapy has been discussed elsewhere (see Urolithiasis: Overview).
Hi Vicki,
Some tricks I do for my blind babies that may help Scoop. Trink has sonar like a bat and rarely crashes into things but Brick goes full tilt into everything...head first!
I have a bubble-wrapped house. :p The legs of furniture are wrapped and taped with bubble-wrap, wall corners bubble-wrapped or have pipe insulation on them, and certain areas of the wall are bubble-wrapped as well where Brick is prone to crashing. My house will never be in Better Homes and Gardens! :D
Brick is very tactilly oriented, meaning he knows where he is by what his feet feel. So there are rugs of various naps in places like one where his food and water bowls are, one where his box (carry case) that he sleeps in is, one by the front door, one by the bedroom door, one in my bathroom - all a little bit different texture so he knows when he steps on them where he is.
When I first got Trink, I wore bells on my ankles so she would always know where I was. But the sound drove me nuts after a bit and really interfered with nature watching so I started doing something that used to drive me batty in others - dragging my feet when I walk. By shuffling around, Brick and Trinket can always find and follow me. I also talk out loud allll the time but that's not something I started with them. My ex used to say anytime he wanted to find me all he had to do was be quiet for a minute and he'd hear me talking away to myself somewhere. :p That has come in handy with Brick and Trink.
Neither of them play with toys but they will play with my hands and arms. I can tap the floor or swish my hands on the floor and they attack! :p Trink thinks she's a bulldozer and does her best to push my hand/arm all over the place, pouncing, growling and mouthing something fierce. Yeah, a fierce 6-pounder! :p Brick stomps around tossing his head, flinging his legs, barking his weird little ARK-ARK, occasionally taking my hand or arm in his mouth as he ARK-ARKs, that little tail a blur of wags. He will follow the sounds of my movements around the floor just as happy as if he had stuffed toy to toss. He dearly loves it when I am on the bed with my feet dangling down! He gnaws my toes, stomping around and tossing that head, ARK-ARKing for all he's worth! :D:D Experiment with things that Scoop may enjoy participating in even tho it's not the same kind of play he used to take part in. You may have to teach him that it's still ok to play with Mom and that she will protect him while he does play. I had a deaf and blind Dane who loved to play with a really nasty blanket I would drag around behind me. She could follow the scent of that blanket. ;)
I keep 2 TVs going from the time I wake up until we go to bed - one in the LR, one in my bedroom at almost opposite ends of the house. I hate the constant noise but when I tried to keep them off, Brick kept getting lost. He orients by the sound of those TVs and doesn't crash into things near as much with them on as he did with them off. So I learn to tune out the sound most of the time. ;)
Keep things in the same places at all times. If something needs to be moved for some reason, put it back where it was asap. Keep Scoop's beds, blankets, feed and water bowl in the same spot all the time. Toys and things that used to be part of Scoop's day are now obstacles if left on the floor so things like that need to be kept up when he's not engaged with them.
Hope you have a good day today, all of you!
Hugs,
Leslie and the gang
Hey Vicki
Just wondering how you both are
Xxx
Addy, thanks. I looked on some blood test results from 1/23 and it says Scoop's albumin was in the normal range, result 2.9, ref range 2.5-4.0g/dL
Of course things could have changed since then. This protein thing was a surprise.
Next week he goes for a BUN/CR test.
On Friday we did not see the vet. The tech took time and talked to me. She said they take 3 BP readings, then take an average. She said the vet will do the average but she told me his highest reading was 168/121. I said I had no idea what a dog's should be and she said pretty much like ours. So that number is high. See if she gives me the average reading when I hear about his urine culture results.
Here is the thing about Bp checks: when they checked Zoe's they forced her to lay down and her's spiked from the stress. The vet made the two techs wait for at least five minutes while he rubbed her head and spoke to her. Once he saw Zoe seemed calmer, he had them retake the blood pressure two more times on a different leg. Had they not waited and allowed her to settle, she would have had 3 high readings.
Some members have the BP check done in the car or have their pup stand durring the test for less stress.
So you have to ask " How does stress affect Scoop's BP tests?" Cpuld stress contribute to his readings/ How is stress figured into the equation for Scoop?"
you are doing just fine.:):) I know the protein through you for a loop.
Hi there:
Just was reading about the blood pressure readings. Very distressed when I read the stuff about the bottom number. My Vet says they don't usually do bottom numbers on dogs and Tipper's has been around 160 and he said that was good. He never seems to give me the correct information. I thought I could trust them with something a simple as blood pressure, now I am wondering. Is the 160 too high??
The vet called me yesterday. I had called to request a referral for an IMS visit for Thursday. She talked to me about that and she said at that time his urine culture had not grown. I asked if she had the BP average. She said she hadn't figured it out. I asked what the lowest reading was because I had the highest from the tech the other day. Lowest 147/109, highest 165/121. She said she didn't think his numbers were too bad. I'll see if the IMS comments on them on Thursday.
Addy-I'm sure stress affects Scoop's BP's. He hates going there. He shakes the whole time we sit in the waiting room. I know they are different from his trembles at home.
That's my girl:D:D:D:D Good job sweetie!!!!!!!!!
(((((((((((((((((hugs)))))))))))))))))))))))
Leslie-Thanks for the tips and I love the comments about your pups. They are precious. This horrible disease has changed Scoop something terrible. It makes me so sad. Yesterday he slept more than usual and he usually sleeps a lot. I wish I knew for sure if the tumor is affecting his optical nerve. I would love to have his one eye done so he could see again. I just want to help him and it's so hard.
Hey Vicki
Good news re the IMS, do you have to go far to see them? Will be good for you to have that specialist to refer to if you aren't getting answers from your vet
Be back later am supposed to be working :D
Xxxx
Thanks Addy and Mel
No, not far. Takes about 10-15 minutes.
Scoop saw an IMS in Nov which was over an hour away. We saw that one because it was at the same time he had his MRI done plus Scoop's vet recommended this one. We liked the one an hour away but I thought with having one close it might be better. Scoop's vet talks to the one further away if she has any questions. I asked the vet if she has ever worked with the one close by. She said yes. She said she is very straight forward and doesn't hold your hand. The vet knows what I'm like. There's also a man IMS in the same place. See how it goes.
Oh Vicki, that's terrific that you'll be seeing the IMS!!!! :)
Is this the same IMS with whom your vet has been consulting, or is it somebody new? Either way, I strongly encourage you to ask about shifting to twice daily trilostane dosing for Scoop. I know we've talked about it in the past, and here's a chance for you to really tack down some information. I'm reminded about it again this morning after just now typing this reply to a new member whose dog also is diagnosed with both diabetes and Cushing's:
http://www.k9cushings.com/forum/show...6236#post96236
If necessary, please print out the two articles I mention in my reply and take them in with you for the consultation, OK? All along, I've wondered whether Scoop would be far more stable if only he was being dosed twice daily...
Marianne
Atta girl! :D At the very least, you will always know you are giving Scoop every opportunity for the best quality of life possible. Please let us know what the IMS has to say and what the culture/BP results are when you learn them.
I'm so proud of you! :)
Hugs,
Leslie and the gang
Marianne-No not the same one. The one she consults with is the one Scoop saw in Nov and is over an hour away. This one is 10-15 minutes away. I figure two are better than one. I just thought it would be easier to go close. I liked the one further away. Just didn't know about traveling that far if I don't have to. My husband worried when we went to Metropolitan(the one further away). The one time m daughter couldn't go with me and my husband went along.I still remember talking to the IMS in Nov. I asked about twice daily dosing and she told me she splits the dose but also increases the dose and from what I understand that's not the way to do it, right? I sure don't want to put more Vetoryl into Scoop and make that horrible tumor grow any faster than it already is.
Leslie-Thanks
As of yesterday the culture has not grown. She said she would give it till today. She didn't have an average of his BP but the highest was 165/121 and the lowest was 147/109. She said she didn't feel they were too bad. So if nothing grew in the culture between yesterday and today I probably won't hear anything else.
I am a little concerned about something. When I talked to a tech at the IMS office about Scoop's appointment she said no food or water and only 1/3 his insulin in case the doctor wants to do an ultrasound. I asked about his meds and told her what he is taking. The tech put me on hold and asked the doctor. He is not to get any meds, just insulin. She also said no water after 2:00AM. Is that going to be OK to not give him water? The last couple of mornings we has been drinking pretty much. This morning he got up at 3:30 for a drink and had more at 4:30, total 3 oz. Then after he ate, another 3 oz. Yesterday by 6:30AM he drank 7 oz. but that also includes after he eats and he won't be eating that morning. I hate when I have to hold back on his food. I told the tech he's been drinking more but she said hold it.
Since Scoop will not e getting his Vetoryl in the morning will he just skip it that day or do I give it to him later after we get home?
They aslo have an alternative medicine doctor in the same place. She also does acupuncture. I know Doc and Ugga have had good results with acupuncture.
I asked Scoop's vet if the Benazepril will make him drink or pee more. She said it shouldn't. He just seems thirstier the last couple of days since he's on the new med. Could be anything with Scoop though.