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Dear Addy
We all seem to be going through the same issues with our babies,just different parts of the body. I hope Zoe's eye problems resolve themselves. Know what you mean about some of the specialists.
Will post about Apollo's latest issues. I feel with the additional conditions and medications more issues seem to surface.
Hang in there my dear friend.
Hugs Sonja and Apollo
Hi Addy,
Just wanted to stop by. I always check in on you and Zoe. I'm sorry to hear she is still having so many eye issues, but glad to hear the Cyclosporine and GenTeal are helping. I use the GenTeal gel on Hannah too. I have used it myself a few times as well, and it definitely lasts longer than the drops.
Hannah is still itching away over here. It has gotten worse. I am back to the Hydroxyzine for $40 a month because it seems to work better than Claritin or Benadryl. We are doing weekly baths as well. I don't get more than 2 hours of sleep at a time before she wakes me up itching or whining (I don't know if it's because she wants food or wants to be up on the bed)
She has been slipping more lately on our wood and tile floors. I'm worrying those back legs are getting weaker. For a while I was feeling really positive and calm about her, and now my fears are back and I am worrying that she isn't going to be around as long as I had been thinking. I tend to worry and be more negative when I am stressed, and I am definitely stressed right now, so maybe that is it. Geez! Sorry to babble on and on when I came to say hello to you!
Anyway, I think of you and Zoe all the time, and check on you often, so I just wanted to say hi.
Julie & Hannah
Addy: I took CoCo to the vet this morning. He has thyroid problems and was put on Soloxine 1mg q12h, I think the vet said the measurements were .08. Forget to get a copy of the numers, but I will when I go back in 3 weeks. I just wondered if this was the normal dose for a 13 pound dog. Maybe this will help his hair and his weakness. I will try to start him on Lysodren in a couple of weeks when I can watch him closely. His alt, alkp and cholesterol were higher than six months ago. Did not do his cortisol until ready to start medicine. Thanks, JoAnne
Sorry Zoe is still having so many problems with her eyes. I wonder sometimes how these sweet dogs can have one problem right after another and still wag their tails and make us so happy with a sweet lick, although my dachshund is not much of a licker. Hope you and Zoe have a good day. Thinkng of Zoe and all the sweet puppies that are having so many problems. Hugs, JoAnne
Thank you guys for checking in on us. We are doing okay. I am having my own allergy problems and have not been feeling well. I think another sinus infection is in the making.
Zoe goes for her stim tomorrow. Cross your fingers that she did not pogo up.
I noticed when the air conditioning is on, she does not drink as much water and does not need to go out as much. She seems to be sleeping a lot. I worry about any systemic side effects from the fluriprofen.
All in all she seems fine. At least as fine as she can now be. We have a new standard for "feeling good" these days.
I always get very anxious when we have to have her stim. I find it nerve wracking.
Wish us luck tomorrow. Wish I felt better.
love,
addy
awww.... I hope you are feeling much, much better real soon and that the results are just as you wish them to be.
Hugs,
Leslie and the gang
Good luck tomorrow! I hope you're feeling better soon! I'm feeling crappy too; not sure if it's allergies or a cold, Ugh! Sending positive thoughts your way. I'll be thinking of you tomorrow!
Julie & Hannah
Hey Julie,
zoe is slipping a lot too on the hardwood. I have her back on one day walk, one day off. I noticed yesterday she did not knuckle drag till the end of the walk, big improvement. She also stood up on her hind legs Saturday while i was trying to watch The Preakness and did her scratchy thing on the sofa. Have not seen that in a while. Point is, that one day on one day off seems to help her hind legs. Maybe it would help Hannah.
Leslie- still holding your hand
JoAnn- I posted on your thread
Will be waiting for the results.
Love to you and Zoe.
Hugs Sonja and Apollo
Hi Addy-
Whenever you do divide your hostas......you probably already know this---do it early in the AM or early in the evening....then be sure to water right away.
Ginger the Gardener
Hijack!!
Hey Ginger, Do you grow herbs???? I have started my first "herb garden" this year - all in pots. Would love some tips! :D
Did I miss any stim results?
I hope you are feeling better!!! I was taking a quiz on hypothyroid symptoms and one of the questions was about sinus infections, headaches from the eye, etc. Have you checked your thyroid lately?
Mom asked if I had a good time at the PARTEE--did you? :D
You are such a good mom to all yourself. Keep up the GREAT JOB!! :)
((((HUGS))))
No Sister Marie Irene- I just got the stim results now after work
pre 5.1 post 5.8
her pre went up more than her post. she was 2.3 and 3.9
could that be from stress? she had eye doctor visit Saturday and was stressed and stim was Tuesday.
IMS said come back in 2-3 months unless something comes up. meanwhile she had a potty accident when I got home
now what? Opthalmalogist wants to either increase cyclosporine to 2% or use steriod eye drops which could ulcerate her cornea. We see him again June 2nd.
Marianne??????? Any thoughts??????
sad addy
Hi, Addy.
Sorry to hear you are not feeling well, sad and Zoe is still having issues. :( I so wish there were easier answers for all these little ones. They certainly do not deserve to have all these problems. I really hope you get a break soon.
Oh Sister Addy,
I wish I could hug you in person and make it all better!! :o:)
With Zoe's numbers going up a little and the accident; the IMS doesn't want to go up a little with the trilo? I mean she could have been stressed, but I would think by Tuesday she would have moved on from that situation. Does she weigh more now than last time and her dose is off? I am not anywhere near being an expert on this so I hope Marianne can give you better info.
I cannot even give you advice on the eye stuff--I am like Mary Beth I wish there were some easy answers to all this and Zoe & the rest of them didn't have to go through all this medicine and problems. (Boy that is a long sentence :rolleyes:)
Here are the best (((((HUGS))))) I can give you right now.
I agree with Marie Irene's thoughts.
I am leaving now, will swing by and pick up Marie, then we'll be up to squish you with a huge hug!!
It WILL get better.
Love,
Sus
Dear Sad Addy,:(
We are all here sad with ya!:(
Here's hoping sweet Zoe will get some relief soon so mommy and the rest of us can be happy again.:)
Stay strong, but take breathers in between please...
We love ya dearly.
xo Jeanette and Princess
ps: I hate it when they slip on the hardwood floors. Princess does all the time in our bedroom--time for wall to wall carpetting for the pupper..$$$$$:eek:
Hi there, Addy :o
All I can say is, PHOOEY!! :( Or make that, DOUBLE PHOOEY!! :( :(
Did the IMS make any comment over the fact that Zoe's cortisol has increased?? Seems weird to me to just sign off for 2-3 months! :mad: Especially when Zoe has already exhibited her history of pogo-ing.
OK, girlfriend. I've been wracking my brain trying to think what I'd do if Zoe were mine. Since she's currently taking 40 mg. once daily, I think I'd finally take the plunge and experiment with twice daily dosing. Is her trilostane in a dose that would allow you to try giving her 20 mg. both in the morning and evening? I know Dechra says to increase the overall dose slightly when shifting to twice-daily, but I think with Zoe, I'd just go for 20/20 to begin with, if that dosing combo is possible for you. I really can't see why your IMS would have a problem with giving that a try, since it doesn't involve an overall dosing change. If she has some other explanation for dealing with the higher ACTH result, fine! But if not, I'd want to finally try the twice-daily dosing suggestion of Dr. Allen's.
As for the eyedrops, remind me of your worry about shifting to the higher-dose cyclosporine drops? Have cyclosporine eyedrops been linked to the same degree of worry re: side effects as oral cyclosporine (Atopica)? In my ignorance, I would think (hope) that the risks would be lesser with eyedrops. But I really don't know for certain. Please tell us what your worries are about the eyedrops, and that will help us to sort through them with you.
Sending many hugs, knowing HOW frustrating this roller-coaster ride must be!!
Marianne
IMS's nurse left a message that IMS was fine with the numbers and happy about them and hoped I would be too. Last fall when I let it ride and then had to deal with mom and put zoe on the back burner zoe dropped from 12.3( i think) down to 9.6 (I think) with no change in dose in 3 months but then the next 3 months she went back up.Quote:
Did the IMS make any comment over the fact that Zoe's cortisol has increased?? Seems weird to me to just sign off for 2-3 months! Especially when Zoe has already exhibited her history of pogo-ing.
2% cyclosporine has side effects and I read that the small dose of clycosporine should be used in small dogs. That the .2 was not a problem. I read about it on the Wedgewood Compounding Pharamcy page. Hair loss around the eyes, and I forget what else. I should go find it and post it. I
Meanwhile, her eye looks better today, she drank less water last night and happily took her chicken walk with me and Koko.
I am thinking of maybe letting it ride for two months, retest and if she is still over 5 then go to twice day dosing because she did drop back down last fall.
Marianne- do you think it is weird her pre and post are almost the same? Have you ever seen that before?
Ill go look and post the wedgewood page.
love ya,
addy
Quote:
•Suppression of systemic lymphoblastogenesis has been reported in small dogs treated with 2% topical cyclosporine, but not with 0.2% (Optimmune®), suggesting that lower concentrations are advisable, particularly in small animals.
Ocular irritation reactions, including conjunctival hyperemia, periocular alopecia and blepharitis are common when topical
•cyclosporine is made from oral cyclosporine (Sandimmune®) but rarely are seen with Optimmune. Ingredients in the oral solution such as alcohol and surfactants as well as higher concentrations of CsA contribute to the irritation response. Cats have a lower tolerance to this ocular irritation than do dogs.
•Experimentally, CsA-induced exacerbations of ocular herpes in cats occurred when used without concurrent virostatic agents.
•Unlike corticosteroids, cyclosporine does not induce collagenase and is therefore not contraindicated in the presence of corneal ulcers.
•Epiphora is an anticipated side-effect of CsA in non-dry-eye patients.
•The bioavailability of CsA is affected by the oil in which it is dissolved. Corn oil and castor oil are desirable vehicles; mineral oil is particularly undesirable. Cyclosporine is an extremely stable molecule, however stability of the ophthalmic preparation is limited by solubility, oxidation of the vehicle and sterility.
Recommended frequency is usually twice daily and can be adjusted more or less frequently to effect. For KCS, ophthalmic cyclosporine usually needs to be continued lifelong. For transient ocular-surface disorders it may be used periodically as needed.
Hi Addy,
When Lulu was taking Trilostane, her pre and post results were consistently in the 2's and very close to identical. As I recall, her post was actually less than the pre a few times and some here were worried about non stimulatory results. I was new to Trilostane so I didn't understand what non stimulatory meant so I was worried. I asked her then gp vet about it and she was not worried because neither the pre or post were suggestive of low cortisol. I believe Marianne may have posted something about this on another thread but I can't remember which one. Hopefully she'll be back to share with you.
Aside from the one accident, is Zoe showing any other signs that cortisol is too high? Can you tell if her pee is concentrated and is she drinking a lot again? If no to both, is it possible that her accident was truly an accident and not cushing's related? If her urine is dilute and her water intake has increased, did you discuss this with your IMS or the vet tech you spoke with? Did you mention to the vet tech that you had concerns about the increase since the last stim and Zoe's history of ups and downs? Having experience with both Trilostane and Lysodren, I can tell you that you have a lot more options with Trilostane. The pressure is much greater with Lysodren to make a decision because things can get out of hand quickly. With Trilostane, I'd be much more amenable to the IMS' suggestion to wait two to three months because you always have the option of making changes sooner if increasing symptoms become evident. If that should be the case, I'd probably make the switch to twice daily dosing, given Zoe's history.
Sorry that I can't help you with the cyclosporin issue. I have no idea what systemic lymphoblastogenesis is. I looked it up and I am still clueless...too technical for my brain this early in the morning. Cyclosporin is probably one of the most prescribed drugs for canine eye problems so I would think that a board certified veterinary eye specialist would be intimately familiar with the drug and its side effects. Have you discussed your concerns with the eye vet about systemic lymphoblastogenesis and did s/he take the time to explain things to you? If so, perhaps you can let us know what the heck it is and what would happen to Zoe if she were to experience this adverse reaction.
That's my two cents worth for now.
Glynda
Addy, I agree 100% with what Glynda has written. If you don't want to tinker with Zoe's trilo dose for the time being, I think that's fine. I just wanted to offer out the twice-daily dosing alternative to you in the event that you were feeling really antsy about this new ACTH result. And I did talk directly with Dr. Allen about the situation where there is very little difference between the "pre" and "post" readings. He said that as long as the dog looked well and both readings were above that lower threshold of 1.45 ug/dl, he would not be concerned.
As far as the 2% cyclosporine, Debbie is probably our best bet as far as explaining what suppression of lymphoblastogenesis is. But my best guess is that it relates to suppression of the production of baby lymphocytes (cells involved in the body's immune response). However, upon Googling a little bit, I found this interesting 2010 article that seems to disprove a worry in this regard:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20840109
So again, I agree with Glynda as to talking over your concerns with the derm vet. He may be able to ease at least some of your fears about this. It does sound as though cyclosporine has been really helpful with doggie eye problems for quite some time, actually with a minimum of documented side effects.
Marianne
Great find, Marianne! Knowing what systemic lymphoblastogenesis is doesn't seem so important any longer. :D
Addy: Sorry you are having problems with Zoe. Since her eyes are some better, maybe it just takes longer for dogs with Cushings to get over problems since they are immune compromised. Hope you and yours have a good Memorial Day Weekend. Hugs to you and yours. JoAnne
I love you guys.:D:D Now if she does not get the hair loss around the eyes we are in good shape. Her 2% cyclosporine is compunded in coconut oil not corn oil.
And yes, Marianne, you knew I was antsy and so disapointed that Zoe went up in her numbers and concerned as you were, she was going to pogo way up. But then I remembered last fall and felt a bit better.
So I will have quite a few questions to ask the eye vet next week.
1-print out Wedgewood sheet and ask ophthamalogist to explain possible side effects including the possible hair loss around the eyes
2- ask how often has he seen side effects in small dogs?
3- ask if zoe would have side effects would we discontinue the drug?
4- if we change from .2 to 2 clyclosporine would she have to take the higher dose the rest of her life or at some point would she go back down to the lower dose?
anything else I should ask?
Cortsiol-
I believe Zoe is now concentrating her urine. She is not drinking as much water, especially when the air conditioning is on. There are times we take her out to pee ,she does not want to go out and we insist because in the past, sometimes she does not want to go out but then 30 minutes later she pees in the house. So it may be we have now confused her by taking her out so much and asking her to pee when she really does not have to.
I think I will watch her for a few weeks and decide what to do as she could very well drift down again. If I do switch I will go to 20mgs BID and give her a few weeks and then retest from there.
I believe IMS thinks that unless I am complaining about uncontrolled symptoms, let Zoe go for a few months as she may well drift down again. She had stim in March, saw derm vet, changed dose, stimmed twice in April, changed dose, stimmed again in May, ended up with a bit over five and she said she is fine where Zoe is unless I am not fine with it.
I feel better guys, thank you so much. I was feeling down because-
My sibling and hubby’s sibling think we should put Zoe down. They think she has too many issues for us to keep up with. They worry it is too much for us and they think her care is confining us to the house and are concerned that we have to run to one vet or another every few weeks. We feel she still has a quality of life. They see a bald dog with a bad eye and weak hind legs that sometimes pees in the house. We see the dog we love, who still gets excited about her chicken walk and goes arrrgggg,arrggg, arggg when we come home and happily takes naps with hubby, laying on her back, snoring away with her feet on his chest or tries to play with Koko and loves very minute of it. I started to wonder if we not seeing the obvious.
I think your sibs are ONLY seeing the obvious. They are totally missing what is essential. And that is Zoe's shining spirit, and the love your family shares. :) :)
Those are the things that really, really matter.
Addy, Ignore the family members' opinions just like I did and enjoy every last minute. You will know - don't let their opinions get you down. If you are down you aren't enjoying the time you have with Zoe. So put on the :D and go hug her. xoxo Kim
I came home and my beautiful dog shook her head and looked at me and did arg, arg, arg and is now telling off a salesperson at the door;):D
I think siblings mean well but Kim and Marianne you are so right. We are heading out the door for our chicken walk before the rains come.
Zoe and I LOVE chicken walk, we talk, we walk, we stop, she eats her chicken, were are still doing chicken walks, life must be good.
Thank you so much for pointing me in the rright direction:D:D:D As usual:D:D:D:D
love you all so very much,
addy
Dear Addy
people don't see what we see. They see a dog that doesn't walk, has accidents, skin lesions on his face and back. We see a little dog,Apollo, who wags his tail when I say do you want a treat, a dog when he is in his stroller who loves to smell the outdoors, still enjoys other dogs, still enjoys his food. They are not property,they are our babies. Would we put down an elder that has issues? NO! So listen to the people who love their dogs unconditional. My vet says, Apollo will let you know when the time comes. As long as they have a quality of life, we still fight for them and enjoy every moment we still have with them and look back with no regrets,knowing we did the best for them,my dear sister in arms.
Love Sonja and warrior Apollo
Dear Sister Addy,
You and your hubby know who Zoe is; so they might not know the love of an animal or the love you share with them. Of course you wouldn't want Zoe to suffer and will know when the right time is--which isn't now. Would you put them down if they were a little sick and couldn't walk as good as before?--of course not. And I too know they mean well, but....I cannot believe they said that to you.:eek:
Enjoy the weekend. I like your plans--I should think about trying them. Everyone is taking a nap right now, but me--tried earlier, but Ella kept barking at people from the upstairs bedroom window--it is cute to see her looking out with her chin on the window sill. :)
These little furballs of ours always play the cute card. I wish you had a video of the chicken walk....:D
Happy Weekend!!!
People suck! :mad:
Sorry, just saying...:D
More Zoe and Addy please.
xo Jeanette
glad you are enjoying your chicken walk. please ignore the siblings. I've had more than a few people tell me that about Jenny. How can we not help her as long as she is enjoying life? hugs, Judi
It is not for others to tell us what to do and how to behave.
Yesterday a "friend" told me to Back Off! from Ryan. He's 32 and we are too interfering. His living arrangements are changing and both Bob and I have felt things getting a bit different,.....as they should with time. She thought we had too much contact with Ryan and that he came down here too often. I was really thrown for a loop and got VERY upset. I called Ryan, asked if he felt we were crowding him, interfering. He said "Absolutely not."
I don't understand where some people get off thinking they have all the answers.....and I didn't even ask for her opinion........as I bet you did not from your sister-in-law. NONE of us could do anything to hasten our beloved pet's time here on earth. A waggy tail, a chicken walk- an arf or an arghhh.,......or even a woof-woof.... that is what a lot of it is about. You and you alone will know when the time is right.....and as Marie Irene said....it is not now.
Tell you sister-in-law to bug out.
No, people aren't crap...........some people are crap.:)
Love,
Sus
Thanks guys, sometimes, people dont get. Hubby put it right. Would we put mom down? Everyone was ready to give up on her and she has a wonderful quality of life now because hubby and I would not give up even though it got really hard. They said we dont know if Zoe is suffering. She may have aches and pains. So do we. But I dont think she is suffering.
When Zoe cant do her woof, woof, bouncy act or is not interested in her chicken walk well then it may be a different story.
Right now she is sucking peanut butter off my finger while I type with one hand. I'm grinning from ear to ear:D:D:D:D
I love you guys.
addy
Addy,
I am with everyone else. You and your husband know Zoe best, and YOU will know when it is time. If she is that happy and has that much life in her, it definitely isn't.
Just yesterday I counted and I am currently giving Hannah 7 medications (she has a pretty bad corneal ulcer as of Fri. afternoon and an ear infection), plus she needs a bath once or twice a week and her "privates" wiped with Chlorhexidine wipes daily. She pretty much can't hear and can't see very well and she still has her allergy issues but it's a little better on Hydroxyzine.
Yes, it is a lot of work, and it isn't cheap. But she is still my happy girl who follows me around, wags her tail, gets excited to eat, and is excited every time I put that leash on to go walk one or two blocks. There is no question that she is still happy. With Zoe barking at you, going for her chicken walks, snoring away during her little naps, it is clear that she still is happy living life. YOU, and no one else, will know when she is not.
Keep up the excellent work! Zoe knows how much you lover her!
Julie & Hannah
I was told about 8 years ago that I was cruel to keep Squirt alive simply because she walks funny due to her back legs. Then she got Cushing's and it started again - put her down, put her out of her misery, why make her suffer... :rolleyes: I am told often today what a waste of time and money I expend on keeping her with me. But you know what? Not a single one of them have ever seen the light that shines in her gorgeous eyes over and over each day; they don't see her smile when she sees her mom come home; they don't see her play with toys; they don't feel that warm, fuzzy body snuggle close at night and sigh with contentment; they don't see the joy that fills her when she is on the trail of a critter in the yard or when it's mealtime. In other words, they don't know my Sweet Bebe at all but are speaking from their own, in my opinion, inability to connect with anything not human. It used to make me mad or hurt my feelings but I have come to understand these people are missing out on so much...and you and I and everyone here is oh so blessed to be able to make that connection with our babies. So just let it roll off you and find a way to have compassion for their loss. ;) Somehow, I don't think that will be hard for you. :)
Many hugs,
Leslie and the gang
Harrah, harrah!! I second Leslie's words.
s
Dearest Leslie,
Your last post here simply made me cry. Couldn't have said it any better. So true dear friend. Wish we can make the rest of the non-animal world see it as well. I hear the same thing from many about "wasting" money on my dog. My reply to that "she's not a dog, she's my third child". :)
You are just wonderful Leslie.
We love ya, xo Jeanette and my very loved third sweet child Princess. lol:D
So true, Zoe is my perpetual child, she is my little girl and her personality is larger than life. She and I communicate without words sometimes, just looks. She still makes me laugh, she still looks at me with that zoe look, she still does her rod stewart impersonation (she shakes her head and then her hair sticks our straight up on top and she tucks her chin and then sticks it out and barks) why that reminds me of Rod Stewart, I will never know:D:D:D:D
She knows when I have a headache and will check on me. Zoe is my once in a lifetime dog and I will know when it is her time.
I think from now on when the siblings inquire we will say she is "just fine" and when they stop over I will just point out happy things about Zoe before they decide to "help".
Thanks guys, It is comforting to know we all feel the same way. I got down because I started thinking, I am with her everyday, maybe I dont see something they do. But now that we discussed it. I see more than they do. And what I see is all good.
I rounded the hair on her back paws and cut the hair between the pads short. It seems to give her a bit moe traction on the floors.:):)
On a side note, grandkid and I finished the essay for Wellesley College. It is pretty good if I do say so my self. She has a chance to win an all expense paid trip to Boston to visit the college.
Wish us luck!!!!!!!!
love ya all and thank you from the bottom of my heart.
Addy - what everyone here says is so true. You will know when she doesn't have the same quality of life. Right now she is enjoying life and you are enjoying her and the chicken walks :):):) Don't listen to the others - she is your baby and you are her person.
Love to you and our Zoe.
Addy: Everyone is right. Zoe still has a great life with you. She is so lucky to have you and you are so lucky to have her. Hope your grandkid wins. Both of mine are graduating, one a nurse and the other a teacher. We are so proud of them. They have really worked hard. Have a good day. Love JoAnne