So glad to read that Zoe is doing better!
Speaking from very personal experience, it is quite easy!! :(Quote:
Originally Posted by addy
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So glad to read that Zoe is doing better!
Speaking from very personal experience, it is quite easy!! :(Quote:
Originally Posted by addy
It is so weird, I have to always be so careful, I could not even give her a raw diet with fruit and veggies in it, she could not tolerate it, she gets diahrrea just thinking about eating something different, her system is so touchy.
She get's Nature's Menu turkey, 70% muscle meat, 30% organ meat, no bone, synthetic calcium instead of bone is in the food with viatmins and minerals. I add 1 tablespoon per meal of Honest Kitchen Embark. Up until now I could never even increase the Embark without getting mushy stools.
The only fruit I could give her is one blackberry. She can eat rice, maybe a smidgen of oatmeal, pumpkin and that is about it.
So I guess we will now learn why she is suddenly going through constipation.:(:(
Addy
Addy,
So glad Zoe is doing better and you too. You are lucky to haave stocked up on the pumpkin because it doesn't exist here in the grocery stores. Quite a while back I went looking for it to make some muffins and the store manager said they always had it before, but this past year it isn't....
Talk to you later---falling asleep typing this--haha!!
Hope you and Zoe are doing better. I found pumpkin in some organic baby food, but I can't find it in the grocery store again. The fruits I give Apollo are a slice of apple each day, blueberries a few times a week, melon. Apollo would eat anything. We take better care of our little fur balls and too often forget to take care of ourselves.
Apollo almost has two drawers in the refrigerator, two sliding drawers on the kitchen counter, a portable pantry in the kitchen. What does that say about me? But when he looks at me with those big brown eyes and the floppy ears, I do melt.
Hi Sonja and Squirt's Mom,
Zoe LOVES apples! I mean she goes nuts for them. I had to stop giving them to her when she first came down with colitis.
I wonder if she could have a slice a day again like Apollo now that she is constipated?
I think I will try just a little and see how it goes.
Thanks everyone for all the good suggestions.
Oh, since the lignans are fiber and may cause loose stools, do you think that they might help with her constipation? I asked Dr. Oliver that question and he said he did not think they worked that way. I'm confused:(
Addy
Hi Addy,
Some stores now have Stokley's plain pumpkin. I just got some for Corky. Some of the bigger grocery store chains are now starting to carry it.
Terri
Thanks Terri!
I had cans of pumpkin put away but if I am supplementing her food long term, I don't have enough. Her vet won't let me change her diet till we are stable on lysodren.
We will go tonite and look at some other stores.
Thanks again for the help:)
Addy
If my memory serves me, the pumpkin shortage is because of flooding the fields last season, rotting the pumpkins. Hopefully, they will have had a better growing season this year and they will be available again soon!
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always
Hi Leslie,
I asked Dr.Oliver since the lignans are fiber and may cause loose stools, could they act as other fibers and bulk up the stools, absorbing more water, like the pumpkin does.
He thought they did not work that way.
I thought well, if they are fiber and I don't know if they are considered soluble or insoluble fiber, could they not be beneficial for Zoe?
What do ya think????????????????? Or is it not enough fiber to matter? If it can cause diahrrea, you think it would matter.:confused:
Please, oh wise one, your opinion on this matter:D:D
Addy
Let me do a little research on nutrient content for the hulls and I'll get back to you. The "wise one" LOL :o has no idea...LOL
From what I have seen, flax lignans contain both soluble and insoluble fibers. Here are some links on nutrient analysis. Both links used the same lab for the analysis but the last one also offers another analysis, tho it doesn't say who did it. I hope this helps:
Flax Hull nutrient analysis:
http://www.aidshivawareness.org/flax_why.htm
ANALYSIS OF CONCENTRATED FLAX HULL LIGNANS
Test Results Unit
------------------------------------------------------------
Moisture- Forced Draft Oven 9.30 %
Protein - Combustion 24.96 %
Ash 4.89 %
Fiber, Acid Detergent 18.1 %
Lignan 30-65 %
Fiber, Dietary, Total 51.5 %
Carbohydrates, Calculated 52.64 %
Calories 384 Calories/100 G
Tryptophan 0.24 %
Cystine 0.41 %
Methionine 0.42 %
Aspartic Acid 2.28 %
Theonine 0.93 %
Serine 1.15 %
Glutamic Acid 4.32 %
Proline 0.84 %
Glycine 1.39 %
Alanine 1.05 %
Valine 1.10 %
Isoleucine 0.90 %
Leucine 1.31 %
Tyrosine 0.47 %
Phenylalanine 1.02 %
Lysine, Total 0.88 %
Histidine 0.48 %
Lignin 7.0 %
Arginine 1.88 %
Total Fat* 8.21 %
Saturated Fatty Acid** 0.76 %
Total Monounsat. Fatty Acids Calc 1.30 %
Total Polyunsat. Fatty Acid Calc 5.79 %
Calcium 0.48 %
Phosphorus 0.58 %
Iron 0.010 %
Magnesium 0.43 %
Potassium 1.06 %
Sodium 0.042 %
Zinc 0.0055 %
Niacin 34.4 MG/LB
Vitamin B1 - Thiamine Hydrochloride 7.12 MG/LB
Vitamin B2 - Riboflavin 2.69 MG/LB
*Reported as triglycerides
**Reported as fatty acids
(Analysis done by Woodson-Tenent Laboratories: www.wtlabs.com)
Microbial Analysis for Concentrated Flax Hull Lignans
------------------------------------------------------------
Aerobic Plate Count 50 CFU/g
Yeast and Mold Count 30 CFU/g
Coliform Count None detected
E.coli Count None detected
Salmonella spp.(+/-) Negative
(Microbial Analysis done by Department of Veterinary
& Microbiological Science NDSU at Fargo, ND)
http://www.flaxhulls.com/results.html
FLAX HULL REPORT OF ANALYSIS
Test Result Units
Moisture - Forced Draft Oven 9.30 %
Protein - Combustion 24.96 %
Ash 4.89 %
Fiber, Acid Detergent 18.1 %
Lignin 7.0 %
Fiber, Dietary, Total 51.5 %
Carbohydrates, Calculated 52.64 %
Calories, Calculated 384 Calories/100 G
Tryptophan 0.24 %
Cystine 0.41 %
Methionine 0.42 %
Aspartic Acid 2.28 %
Theronine 0.93 %
Serine 1.15 %
Glutamic Acid 4.32 %
Proline 0.84 %
Glycine 1.39 %
Alanine 1.05 %
Valine 1.10 %
Isoleucine 0.90 %
Leucine 1.31 %
Tyrosine 0.47 %
Phenylalanine 1.02 %
Lysine, Total 0.88 %
Histidine 0.48 %
Arginine 1.88 %
Total Fat 8.21 * %
Saturated Fatty Acids 0.76 ** %
* Reported as triglycerides ** Reported as fatty acids
Total Monounsat. Fatty Acids Calc 1.30 %
Total Polyunsat. Fatty Acids Calc. 5.79 %
Calcium 0.48 %
Phosphorus 0.58 %
Iron 0.010 %
Magnesium 0.43 %
Potassium 1.06 %
Sodium 0.042 %
Zinc 0.0055 %
Niacin 34.4 MG/LB
Vitamin B1 - Thiamine Hydrochloride 7.12 MG/LB
Vitamin B2 - Riboflavin 2.69 MG/LB
Respectfully Submitted,
Woodson-Tenent Laboratories, Inc.
David Gross, Mgr of Support Svcs.
Microbial Analysis for Flaxhulls by NDSU
Microbial Analysis for Flaxhulls
Aerobic Plate Count 50 CFU/g
Yeast and Mold Count 30 CFU/g
Coliform Count Non detected
E.coli Count Non detected
Salmonella spp. (+/-) Negative
(Microbial analysis done by department of veterinary & microbiological science at NDSU at Fargo, ND)
Flaxhulls analysis (unknown source and date)
Moisture 8 %
Protein 35 %
Ash 4.1 %
Fiber 41 %
Carbohydrates 41 %
Lignans (SDG or SD) 3.9 %
or 39 mg per gram of product
The following are per 100grams
Calories 391
Calcium 189 mg
Phosphorus 62.6 mg
Iron 7 mg
Magnesium 374 mg
Potassium 716 mg
Sodium 37 mg
Zinc 4.22 mg
Niacin 1.5 mg
Vitamin B1 019 mg
Vitamin B2 .19 mg
Click on these links for More Reports
E and H Labs 2006
August 2005 NDSU Lignan
NDSU 2002
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always
Wow Leslie, where do you find this stuff? I did not expect that much info. I thank you from the bottom of my heart and Zoe's too:):)
Addy
Dear Andy glad to hear Zoe is doing better. I have never concentrated so much on Apollo's pops like now. Some times it 's watery, then like a stick, sometimes normal. I wonder with the weakness in his hind legs and muscles if it is harder for him to go. He has fallen a few times just walking. It just kills me inside , will have to mention to vet , tomorrow.
Send our love and prayers
Sonja and Apollo
Hi Sonja,
Zoe has been stumbling a bit too. She has a weakness in her front paw. She had a soft tissue injury two years ago and it bothers her on and off. Funny thing is when she was on the thyroid supplement, it did not bother her at all. Since I took her off the tyroid Armour natural glandular product, it is bothering her again. I agree, it is sad to watch.
I have had to be a poop watcher for 2 years now. But the good thing is I always know early on when something is wrong and can be proactive about her colitis before the flare up gets really bad. I can catch it early so we never advance to bloody poops. I guess that is looking on the bright side of poop detail:confused::):o
Hang in there, girlfriend, it is almost Friday!
Addy
Dear Andy,
Thanks , today was a little tough. i will post the same on my thread.
The IM0 said he felt Apollo was looking pretty good, until he noticed Apollo stiff walking. He had a neurologist check out says it it muscle atrophy, could be from the cushing. Apollo's skin is somewhat improved, still has a great appetite, hair loss has stopped , some hair has grown back-but very little, still lump in tail (told cystic inflammation and to leave alone-which I have not done)Test done"CBC and Chemistry Profile, Urinalysis, Cystocentesis( to get the urine-go figure?) ACHT Stimulation Test w/o Cort/Antech.
Vet said maybe the good effect of the Trilostane doesn't stay in his system long enough, and maybe will need to give twice a day. Sometimes muscle strength comes back, sometimes no. My husband was so sweet, said if we have to Apollo will get race wheels, we are not giving up on the little guy.
Will get results tomorrow. Nervous.
I cried going home thinking about the muscle wasting. Please tell me it will get better.
Dearest Sonja,
I believe with all my heart Apollo will get better. You just started the medicine, give it some time. Twice a day dosing sounds like a good plan to me. Don't cry about muscle wasting, lets see what we can do to make it better. Let's focus on making it better, if we can.
I know how hard this is for you and I am so sorry about that. Dear girlfriend I have tears in my eyes knowing how upset you are.
Okay, time to rally!!!! Cushings will NOT defeat you, repeat after me, Cushings WILL NOT DEFEAT US!!!!!!!!
Let us research the muscle wasting, you will feel better thinking about how to help that symptom. It will give you a purpose and hope.
Love you,
Addy
Hi Addy,
You are such a GOOD Rallier (is this a word??:D) Keep up the good vibes!!
I think the muscle wasting is part of the game we have to play with cushings. I think just as with arthritis we have to keep them moving. I know Maddie stumbles, her paws sometime bend under, but if it doesn't bother her and she keeps on going then it has to be okay with me--so we all have to be troopers for them. They can sense when we are feeling down; so that is where Addy comes in to save the day!!
Thanks for being there and have a wonderful day with Zoe!!!:):) I get to go fight with my tech department again because for almost 2 weeks my contract system will not work properly and I even got a new laptop:eek::eek:this is how I felt yesterday wanting to pull my hair out or punch something:eek::eek:, but it is Friday and this weekend I get to spend it down at the beach watching the US Open of Surfing Finals front and center (it helps to have a daughter who works the media/PR portion of the event--haha!!):D:D
Hi Marie,
I agree, our babies sure know when we are down. I try to rally Zoe and keep her going, sometimes I worry I push her too hard.
Have a wonderful weekend. Surf's up!!!!!:D
Addy
Thanks for all the input.
Like you said take a break from cushing, after I get the test results.
Praying for a good result.
let me know as soon as you get the results too. I am saying special prayers for Apollo and you.
Sonja, it will be all right. I know it will be all right, the tests will be fine, if we keep saying and believing that, it will be so:)
I gave Zoe her lignans today, hoping she doesn't get diahrrea. Oh well, I still have lots of metronidazole if she does:(:(
Sorry you have to worry all weekend about Apollo's tests. I think a trip to the ocean in his red stroller is in order!!!!!
Love you,
Addy and Zoe
Addy got the results, rushing out the door.
Will post later, good and concerns. will let you know.
We are seeing the IMS today for a recheck and to discuss treatment options and Lysodren. Ims orignially told me she would start Zoe on a conservative dose.
My question: I have read on a link here that 50mg per kg is loading dose. I have also read the UC Davis says if dog is not polydipsia loading dose is 25mg per kg. Another paper with a vet from UC Davis just said outright 25mgs per kg, not 50. I think that paper was in our links as well, can't remember which one, I read so many.
If dog's symptoms are mild without polydipsia or excessive hunger and panting, would the 25mg per kg be the more appropriate loading dose?
I have also read members had loading that when on forever with too conservative of a dose.
Just trying to get my thoughts in order before consultation.
Thanks for your help,
Addy
Addy,
Both of my little guys loaded at 50mg/kg but they were being treated by an IMS that has been treating dogs with Lysodren for years. I have listened to audios and read every paper I could get my hands on by Dr. Edward Feldman. He's a world reknown endocrinologist from UC Davis that I have affectionately nicknamed Mr. Cushing's. He and a few others I've followed state that vets that are leary of Lysodren will load at the lower dose while experienced vets use a higher or maximum dose. Inexperienced vets will also prescribe prednisone concurrently with the Lysodren, which is a really bad idea because the pred masks signs of loading. We've seen dogs here that have gotten into trouble because their vet used this protocol. I asked our IMS that protocol and he agreed that a lot of vets that use that protocol are uncomfortable with Lysodren.
With no polyuria, polydipsia or a voracious appetite, a lot of vets would not treat with Lysodren with so few symptoms. I personally would be very hesitant to treat my dogs with Lysodren with so few symptoms. I had a foster that was diagnosed with Cushing's. Her diagnostic tests, bloodwork and ultrasound were textbook cushing's but her only symptom was severe skin and coat issues. Her dermatologist prescribed Trilostane and she did quite well on it.
Thank you LuLu's Mom,
Zoe's other hormones are high too and she can't have Trilostane, according to the IMS because it could elevate those hormones even more. She has typical and atypical Cushings.
I am hesitant to treat now. Zoe has hair coat symptoms, licks everything and chews, does not want to jump in car anymore, she likes to eat but she doe not beg anymore than my other pup, just more voal about it. But her adrenal panel numbers were sky high. Dr. Oliver said "Significant". Her blood work is not horrible, either,
I really think her numbers were sky high because she had some active infection going on, she had colitis flare up durring all the testing and was severly stressed at the IMS. While I believe she does indeed have Cushings my dilemna is wait to treat ot treat.
After what Kim went through with Annie, I am even more concerned about Zoe and did think perhaps I should continue with the melatonin and lignans and wait for a month of good firm poops, if I can get that and then retest her.
If it was your dog?
Addy
http://www.dvmnews.com/dvm/Small+ani.../detail/460965
this article referred back to an interview with Dr. Feldman and then went on to state 25mg/kg so not sure if that can be traced back to Dr. Feldman or not. Article is from 2008.
it is in our reference links
still looking for the polydipsia article.
Addy
Dear Addy,
Sounds like you are stressed out , like me. When I started Apollo on the trilostane , I did not listen to the vet, I read on the companies web , site and called their vet specialist, because I felt 30mg was too high, I confirmed to start at 10mg, which was the right choice for Apollo. The vet said it would take longer if I started low, and I said then so be it. If they are started too high , a lot of other symptoms can make things worse. So it was me I would start at the lower dose. Most vets just go by the rules and instead of each individual circumstances. What is good for the majority is not always good for the individual. I would talk to your vet about how you are feeling. If it is a good vet , they should discuss with you.
Hopes this help. Better safe then sorry.
Hi Addy,
I have the audio of that lecture given by Dr. Feldman in Seattle and it was this lecture that he mentioned the 25mg/kg vs 50mg/kg. Every hypothetical case he used, the dog was getting 50mg/kg. I'm not quite sure why Dr. Hoskins only picked up on the 25mg/kg in the article. :confused: If you check out the Lysodren Loading Instructions in our Helpful Resources section, you will see that these instructions do indicate the loading dose to be 50mg/kg. You will also see that these instructions are from the Textbook of Veterinary Internal Medicine, which Dr. Feldman co-edited with Dr. Stephen Ettinger. These two gentlemen have written the Textbook of Internal Medicine for years and years. I actually purchased a later edition and boy are they heavy books.
I think your concerns about not having a gauge to determine if Zoe is loaded are justified. I think I mentioned before that I would be hesitant. My Lulu, was on Trilostane for two years before I switched her back to Lysodren. She has typical cushing's with elevations of all intermediate hormones. We went through more than a 30 day washout because we waited until she was symptomatic again. Despite the fact that her intermediates were sky high, she did not become symptomatic until her post cortisol was 25 ug/dl. Lulu weighs less than 5 lbs so there was no way I was going to start loading her until I had something to go on. I made sure her appetite was raging and she was drinking and peeing buckets again.
Dr. Feldman says that the appetite is very important in loading and in order to insurer that the dog has a huge appetite while loading, he recommends that pet owners decrease the dog's food by 1/3 two days before loading. If Zoe's few symptoms become problematic for you and her and you want to start loading, this is something you might want to consider.
Glynda
P.S. I meant to tell you that 25mg/kg is protocol and if you feel more comfortable loading at a low dose, then go for it but be prepared for the possibility that loading will be long and drawn out.
The article says:Quote:
Originally Posted by addy
and BID means twice a day, so the dose referred to in the article may very well mean 25 mg/kg given twice a day, which would = a total of 50 mg/kg/day, just as it says in the Textbook of Veterinary Internal Medicine.Quote:
25 mg/kg, given BID
The loading dose mentioned in the Merck Veterinary Manual does say 25 mg/kg/day, so that is indeed an acceptable protocol for loading, but I think that the Textbook of Veterinary Internal Medicine loading dose (50 mg/kg/day) is the more accepted and more commonly used loading dose protocol, especially when the Vet is an Internal Med Specialist.
Back from the IMS, I think I am stressed from the long visit. She was very patient, answered all my questions. Her first observation was that Zoe looked "harrier" than last visit. Her hair did grow out longer faster but is still thin. She checked the hair on her tummy and said she sees some new growth there and explained the hair cycles to me.
I told her about the constipation, she thought that was odd. Told her we have not used metonidazole since 7/12 and she started lignans and her poops so far have been good.
Discussed my concerns about starting lysodren without symptoms and she said we will wait 3 months, see if she can have a normal 3 months, no more diahrrea, etc and then retest. I almost fell off my chair because that was what I really wanted to do in my heart. If new symptoms develop then we have to go back to looking at lysodren.
She has different protocols for lysodren depending on symptoms. She seems to treat the symptoms, not the numbers. Don't know if that is good or bad but I feel that way about it too right now.
I asked about how can her adrenal panel numbers be so high and her symptoms so mild and her blood work not as bad as other dogs? She said their hormones can fluctuate just like ours so some vets currently don't like the adrenal panel for that reason, you get false picture with some dogs. Zoe does not follow the norm with this. Also if she was stressed and had infection going on, we get elevated numbers. So said lets retest in 3 months and only do the one test first thing in the am so Zoe does not get so stressed.
She said wait for her to be "normal" for about 4 weeks and then give rabies shot. She said with a dog that has a tendency to be snappish, she recommends the shot. Just wants me to wait a bit longer to make sure she stays healthy.
She is so patient and answers all my questions, I really like the IMS alot. I think I could have a good relationship with her. Also she seems up to date on things, so like that even more.
Hope she knows what she is talking about but right now I trust her. Looks like we enter that "gray zone" for awhile now. I know some of you have been there too.
Zoe was unbelievable, no muzzle, greeted IMS, you would not have known it was the same dog, she was so calm and quiet. I though someone switched dogs on me. She was like she used to be so sweet.
Oh, she detected a slight heart murmur she could not hear before. She said very slight, don't worry about it right now.
That was it. Opinions?
Thanks all,
Addy
Hi Addy,
IMHO, your IMS is spot on! :) Giving Zoe a chance to get healthy again and get over her recent problems, and then see if the signs stay and strengthen is the way to go. The signs are so important not only in diagnosing but in monitoring treatment. Your IMS is also right about other problems causing things to look like Cushing's when it isn't.
Treating symptoms (signs) and not the numbers is what we say here. As long as a pup is doing well, the numbers aren't that important. Some pups do better with their cortisol a bit higher, or a bit lower, than the numbers say is right. So treating the dog not the numbers is a good plan.
I am curious about her "different protocols" for using Lyso, tho. This could be an issue down the road depending on what that means if it does turn out Zoe has Cushing's.
For now, YIPEE!!! You and Zoe have a reprieve and I hope it is permanent! But, that doesn't mean you get to just disappear...oh no! You have to keep in touch and let us know how ya'll are doing, ok?
Hugs,
Leslie and the girls - always
Hi Leslie,
Oh thank you for your input. First I was relieved after the appointment and then at 2:00 this morning I got scared, worrying the IMS might not know what she is talking about:confused:
I think Zoe has Cushings, I really do. I think we go to watch and wait for 3 months.
IMS did not go into detail about her protocol, just that if she has a dog presenting strong symptoms she will want to go after the adrenal gland and "hit the Cushings on the head and burn some adrenal gland off" i think was the phrase she used and she would load with lysodren. Some strong symptoms IMS mentioned: extreme weight problem so she doesn't have to worry about diabetes, excessive panting all night, excessive drinking, accidents in the house, all the symptoms Glynda mentioned to me, or IMS said milder symptoms, which she did not explain, she would put on maintenance dose "to coax it along" and not load. We never got to discuss the actual dosage.
IMS wants to see what Zoe's coat does when fall comes. She said we might see stimulation of new hair folicles at that time.
I gave Zoe 3mgs of melatonin last night, she is zonked this morning. I will wait a week and try to start giving some durring the day. I sure hope I can keep her healthy.
Why would she behave so differently? She has been terrible at the vets the last 3 times. I sat in the back seat of the car with her and held her and massaged her for the hour drive and when we got in the examining room I had brought chicken and asked her to do some free shaping and she gave me some cute behavior and I rewarded it and then she calmed down and just lay on the floor, did not care I picked her up to put her on examining table, let IMS touch her, OMG, maybe she finally just feels better and nothing hurts?:eek::):D
And don't worry, I am not going anywhere, you won't give rid of me that easily!!!!:D:D:D
Thanks so very much,
Addy
Yeah Addy!!!! and Zoe too!!!!
Good news!!:D Maddie had too many of the symptoms so it was not an issue to treat or not and the numbers were there also.
I am soooo happy for you, but you have to stick around you have such a good way with words to cheer everyone on.....:D:D
So does this mean Zoe doesn't have ATypical also???
Hi Marie,
Atypical? Who knows?:confused:
I forgot to ask. :o
She has Cushings, IMS just wants to wait for more symptoms to develop. Wants her to get healthy before treating with anything other than the melatonin and lignans.
Feels her symptoms only warrant that at the moment. I do not know how long we will wallow along in that area everyone calls the gray zone.
I took vacation time next week thinking I would be loading Zoe. Guess we will try to have some happy time now instead.
I just worry about keeping her healthy.
Thanks for being there for us Marie,
Addy
Just wanted to say Zoey is absolutely adorable!!!! My best to you both trying to get this darned disease figured out.
Donna
Hi Addy,
For what it's worth, I really like what your IMS had to say. It all makes perfect sense to me. I also understand her different approach to treatment depending on the symptoms. I think I mentioned to you earlier that a cushing's savvy vet will not recommend treatment if a dog is asymptomatic or if symptoms are extremely mild.
I love the way your IMS explained how she would go after the adrenal glands. :D Her description of burning some adrenal gland off could put off a pet owner but I personally think it's great because if the vet is doing her/his job, the pet owner needs to know that Lysodren is one serious drug. I think she made her point with that statement.
I've heard that phrase "we're treating the symptoms, not the numbers" from members who treat with Trilostane. It is exceptable for post cortisol to be as high as 9 ug/dl as long as symptoms have resolved. Some members have found that their dogs do better by letting the cortisol run a little high. I don't believe this is what your IMS was referring to. I believe her rationale is that if a dog has overt symptoms like voracious appetite, panting constantly, peeing and drinking buckets, then she is going to recommend that full on lysodren loading be started. Once you start loading your vet will have shifted gears from symptoms, which are apparent, to the numbers and will be aiming to get Zoe's post stim number in the tried and true therapeutic range of 1 - 5 ug/dl.
If symptoms are mild but troublesome to you, her or both of you, she's not going to be comfortable with loading with such mild symptoms so her plan of attack is a maintenance dose of lysodren to try to reduce the cortisol a bit. This will also reduce some, if not all, the intermediates so that's not such a bad approach.
I don't know about the rest of you but I could be wanting to rip somebody's head off but if you massage me for an hour and then feed me something that activates my salivary glands to the point of making me drool, you will succeed in taking the wind out of my sails and greatly adjusting my attitude. Why wouldn't Zoe feel the same way?
Glynda
Good for you Addy,
It sounds like your IMO is good. Good luck to Zoe, sounds like she knew when she went in things were going to be okay, and trusts the IMO. All I know is when I go to see my IMO, Apollo seems excited to go in? Maybe he know he is going to be taken care of ?
Glynda, Donna, Sonja,
I always take chicken with me to the vet, it just was different this time, can't explain it. Maybe asking her to give me tricks short circuited her brain out of fear, all I know I had my Zoe back for that visit and it felt so good.
Thank you Donna, you baby is pretty darn good looking too!!!!
Glynda- I understood everything you told me I was just so terrified of what would happen to Zoe if I did not treat but IMS says 3 months is no problem for Zoe. I think you hit it right on the head about what IMS was telling me.
The IMS seemed very suprised Zoe had not been on a maintenance dose of metronidazole since July 12th. She did say that if the diahrrea starts up again and Zoe has frequent bouts, we have to revisit the lysodren.
NO PRESSURE THERE!!!!!!!:eek::eek::eek:
If you think I was obsessed with poops before, LOOK OUT!!!!!:D:D:D
Honestly, I feel exhausted right now.
Sonja- I have to check your thread to see what happened today. Need to walk the pups first.
I'll be back!
Addy
Addy
Hi Addy,
Haven't posted much but have been following along.
Made me laugh but but true ;) also the thought that dogs have a keen sense about them and just maybe Zoe felt or sensed the kindness and confidence that your IMS has.Quote:
I don't know about the rest of you but I could be wanting to rip somebody's head off but if you massage me for an hour and then feed me something that activates my salivary glands to the point of making me drool, you will succeed in taking the wind out of my sails and greatly adjusting my attitude. Why wouldn't Zoe feel the same way?
Glynda
Wishing you continued good luck and like Leslie said, you better not disappear:eek: Need to keep hearing from you and Zoe. :)
Hi Addy,
I'm glad you found a good IMS. She definitely seems to know what she is doing. My IMS is the same way. When Corky's symptoms disappeared, she definitely told me not to treat Corky until there were clinical signs, which was actually 7 months later.
I hope things go well for you and Zoe. Relax and take some deep breaths.
Terri
Oh thank you guys, so good to hear from you.
I don't feel like I have a reprive, I will just be watching everyday for new symptoms:eek:
The thought of trying to keep her poops firm is freaking me out!!!!! This morning I thought I lost a baggy with chicken in it and Koko and I ran for 4 blocks to get home to check to see if Zoe had it. I kept thinking, oh come on, it has only been 2 days!!!!
Now, I have asthma, so that was no small feat, let me tell you!!!!:D:D
Maybe I have revisit to Addy and the muzzlers!!!!
Addy