Lucygoo - Pit. macroadenoma, endoscopic transsphenoidal surgery, trans-oral approach

I am reading your posts. I do hel that the surgery will work for your boy.

I had a Siberian Husky named Pebbles that was diagnosed with diabetes, hypothyroidism and Cushings. She lived 10 months after the Cushings diagnosis. She was rushed to Texas A & M just screaming the whole 2 hour ride. She was there for 3 days. Refused to eat. Ended up going Addisonian. The screaming was abnormal vocalization. The lack of appetite and her not recognizing me was all caused by a macro tumor. It was pressing on her brain and causing all of this. There wasn't much that could be done. These symptoms came out of nowhere. I put her down as there wasn't anything that we could do. Radiation is hard enough and dangerous for a cush pup let alone diabetes and hypothyroidism, The IMS there said most dogs if caught early will last a few more months.

I am happy to hear that surgery is one of your options. Weren't they doing the surgery in the Netherlands?

Hi Gina,

I have been reading your thread and I just want to tell you that our prayers and best wishes are with you and Lucy. Hang in there. It sounds like you may have an option which will allow Lucy to have some quality of life if,
in fact, she is a candidate for this procedure. I think you are a wonderful mother to Lucy and I know you are doing all that you can! I wish you girls the best outcome...Good luck tomorrow.

with love and prayers,
Dorothy and Mikey

Hi everyone...

Thank you so much for your kind thoughts and wishes and very sound advice. I feel better already. I finally found something to give Lucy that she actually seems to relish...meatballs from Palermo's Restaurant..who knew!! I'll be calling them later today to see how many they can make me. Picture that call...."Can you make me about 50 of your meatballs, please."
As for her eating otherwise, she'll eat chicken if I hand feed her, and even some dog food if I had feed her....nothing from the dish. I'll try out the soup and buttermilk idea, tool...thanks Alison.

She seems a bit more back to her old self this morning. Guess we'll see what happens tomorrow....

Much Love,
Gina and Lucy

YAY, Gina!!

I'm so glad that Lucy is eating her meatballs! And I just wanted to stop by to wish you much luck tomorrow with the MRI. Of course, first of all, that all goes well and it is not stressful for Lucy. And secondly, that if it IS a macrotumor -- that it will be operable.

Please let us know as soon as you are able!
Fingers and paws crossed at our house for you and Lucy,
Marianne (forever Barkis and Peg's and Luna's mom)

Hi Gina,
Glad to hear that Lucy is eating. Meatballs sounds good. (make sure there aren't any onions in them) I think most dogs are italian, they all seem to like italian food:)

My best wishes to you and Gina for the testing. Hope all goes well. Keeping good thoughts and prayers that it's something easy to manage or fix.

John (Roxee's Dad)

Hi Gina,

I have not posted to you before - just finished reading about Lucy. Glad to hear that Lucy is eating the meatballs. I want to wish you good luck tomorrow with the MRI. Keeping the two of you in my thoughts and prayers. Hugs to you and Lucy.

Hi Gina,

Just stopping back...I have been watching your thread about Lucy. I am sending lots of well wishes for the MRI tomorrow and will be anxious to hear about the surgery. I do hope she can have it and it works!!!
All my best!
Beth, Bailey and always Scooter

Hi Gina,

I would also like to join in and offer my support for you and well-wishes for Lucy tomorrow.

Will be thinking positive thoughts for both you and Lucy and awaiting your update.

Louise

Wishing you the best on the MRI tomorrow.

Just be careful as to how much fat your baby is getting. Cush pups are prone too pancreatitis . It is advised to keep them on a low fat diet. What about 99%fat free turkey meatballs?

Gina,

Just re-upping all my healing thoughts and prayers for Lucy.
Will be anxious to hear how the MRI went. Praying for the best.

Tons of Hugs
~ Mary Ann

Hi all...

Sorry to say that I was up all night with Lucy last night. She had severe diarrhea and cramping....she really seemed like she was in distress. I gave her an imodium about 2 a.m.....didn't really do much. I don't know if it scared me so much because I'm more focused on her now, but I've never seen her like that. I literally laid on the floor with her all night. Tried e-mailing Dr. B at 3 a.m.....got my e-mail kicked back....

To make a long story short, I ended up bringing her to his office at 6 a.m., which happens to be open all night for emergencies too, so now they're giving her fluids and checking her out .

I feel kind of stupid now for bringing her in now, but it seemed like she was in such pain with the cramps, panting like crazy, even in the car on the way over she was doing that back arching thing.

The worst part was when we got there. She wouldn't get out of the car she was so scared. I had to get the guy to come down and he brought a gurney, we put her on that, and I just cried like an idiot, while she looked at me with those eyes.

Sorry for venting guys, but I just am about ready to collapse.

Thanks, Gina

Hi Gina,
I am so sorry that Lucy is going thru this. I hope they find what is causing the problem and it is a simple fix. Kinda went thru the same thing with our Roxee and Rozee a few weeks ago, luckily it was fixed with a shot of B12 and antibiotics. Hope it is that easy on Lucy.

It's okay to vent, we are here for you.

Keeping good thoughts and prayers for you and Lucy.

Catch yourself a nap if you can.
John (Roxee's Dad)

Thanks John....I just heard from Dr. Bruyette...he said she's fine. Everything checked out fine, her chest x-ray was fine, and he's going ahead with the MRI...I'll hear from him later today with what it shows and a "plan."
I swear to God...she probably sensed something was up today and got all stressed out. I just couldn't take watching her spasm like that and not being able to help her. I thought it was neurological at first.
At least they'll put her out for the MRI. (Wish someone would put ME out) Now I have THAT to worry about all day.
Oh, well....pacing and biting nails...I'll keep you posted...
And thanks again for all the heart-felt wishes..

Gina and Lucy...

Hi Gina,

I am SO glad to hear that Lucy is doing fine now. Thank you for letting us know. I'm sure she is in really good hands now. I'll be waiting anxiously to hear the results of the MRI and the subsequent game plan. I hope you can at least close your eyes and get a little rest. Shi's got her paws crossed for Lucy.

Ken

Hi all....We just got back, and Lucy has a very large tumor...I've forgotten the size already, but he basically said she has about 3 months left if we do nothing. I thought surgery would be out of the question because her tumor is so large, but he said they're doing it with an endoscope, brand new surgery, and he doesn't see any reason why they can't do it.

He's meeting with the surgeon on Wed and will let me know for sure, but Dr. Bruyette said he'd be very very surprised if the surgeon said it was inoperable. He also said Lucy's the perfect candidate, because she's otherwise healthy, and a bigger dog, so it's good for their study...which is for both dogs and humans.

She was very happy to see me, of course, but she scared me on the ride home...she kept trying to stand up and was whining a little. I thought it was neurologic...almost like she was having those spasms again...but when we got home she was so happy, she ran around like a puppy for quite some time, came in, drank about 10 gallons of water, and now she's passed out already.

So I guess it's good news....I can't watch her deteriorate any more...and I'm seeing subtle changes it seems like by the day now. My poor Goo. I just hope none of these changes are permanent in her brain. What am I talking about....I just hope she survives the surgery.

Thanks again everyone....You all are the best and have kept me going through this awful, awful time...

I'll keep you posted...

Much love,
Gina and Lucy Goo

Gina,

While the news isn't great - you have one heck of a doctor as your advisor and you had already done your homework and had the options before discovering the tumor. Plus you know you'll have a whole host of cush moms and dads rooting for you and Goo.

You should be very proud of yourself - you are obviously a fantastic mom to her. Give her a big hug from me and mine. Sending hugs and prayers.

Kim

Gina,
You've had a tough 24 hours. At least Lucy is resting comfortably now and you have some answers. I hope that you can get a little rest too.

Knowing how large the tumor is and how long she has, really lays out your options. I truly hope that the surgeon will accept her for the surgery, as this seems her best option. Dr. B may think she has three months without surgery, but those three months could be horrible for her and pure hell for you. Just imagine how she is now, and make it progressively worse and worse until you can't handle it anymore and then have to make the decision to let her go. Under ordinary circumstances this is hard and we second guess ourselves with "what if's". Here the option of a surgery can cure her. Granted surgery carries its own risks, but this risks are far outweighed by the huge benefit she can achieve.

Healing thoughts and prayers for Lucy, and that she will soon have a surgical date.
~ Mary Ann

Hi Gina,

I'm glad the MRI came out so clearly and you now know exactly what you are dealing with. Mary Ann expressed herself extremely well and my thoughts are identical to hers. If Dr. Bruyette and your surgeon say everything is a green light for surgery, I think it is the only way to go. It will be very difficult for you but if it is similar to an adrenalectomy, it very well may provide a complete cure for Lucy. She could live for a long, long time as a totally happy and healthy dog.

Please keep in mind that Lucy is your dog and you are a huge part of this equation. Ask all of the questions you have. I certainly think you should have the opportunity to meet with Lucy's surgeon and I think that will be very meaningful for you. For me, it was a wonderful experience consulting with both of Shiloh's board certified surgeons prior to her surgery. I was convinced that I had the "dream team." You are a courageous woman. All the best to you and Lucy.

Ken

Thanks everyone..

I agree that surgery is my only option at this point. I just hope she can hold out that long. Just went and got her prednisone 20mg and tramadol for pain. Does anyone know how soon the prednisone should start to work? Don't ask me why we didn't get this yesterday. She just seems really uncomfortable today. Hope it kicks in soon....
will keep you posted....

Gina and Lucy

Hi Gina,

I am so impressed with you and how you are handling this with Lucy. You have made the only real decision that you could have for your baby's welfare. It sounds like you have a great team for surgery and, of course, as Kim said, you have "a whole host of cush moms and dads rooting for you and Goo."

Hang in there and keep up the good work! Lucy is so very lucky to have you on her side.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls

It's me being a pain in the butt again....Just a question. Has anyone else had experience with MRI and how long it takes for the anesthesia to wear off? I'm getting really worried about Lucy...she's still out like a light for most of today, has not eaten anything except a couple of bites of lamb stew dog food...finally!....and a few licks of chicken broth....and she keeps hunching her back, like in a spasm, and dragging her hind legs when she first rises. She has moments of clarity where she's perky and runs around, but then zonks out again.
I e-mailed Dr. Bruyette and he said it's probably a combo of the anesthesia and the tumor, and to let him know if it doesn't get any better.

I'm just wondering if anyone has experience with the kind of anesthesia they do for MRIs and what it does. I gave her 20mg prednisone and a tramadol this morning. was waiting for the prednisone to really kick in and give her an appetite, but so far just a couple of bites.

This waiting is awful....but this site is so helpful and comforting.

Thanks, G and L

There is one member active here (that I know of) who's dog has had an MRI (of his back) - Barney's Mom. I'll PM her to make sure she looks in on your thread. I think the anesthesia they use for MRI's would be a little different from that which is used for surgery etc. because of the magnetic fields involved and the type of monitoring/supporting equipment that can be used.


The tramadol could be contributing to Lucy's grogginess (on top of the anesthetic and the tumor) - it is somewhat sedating and can also cause some tummy upset too! It seems individual dogs need/tolerate different size doses with some being really zonked out on a pretty moderate dose - how much does Lucy weigh and what dose of tramadol is she on? I've never used tramadol myself but a lot of other people here have.

The pred she is on is being used to reduce inflammation/swelling and when it is being used for that reason it has been my experience that it seems to kick in to the point that you can see a definite improvement about 10-12 hours after the first dose and (as long as you continue with it) things seem to improve further over the next 3 days or so. My kids have needed oral pred for asthma and I have (although we (me and the treating vet) didn't know it at the time) used it for a dog with symptoms caused by a brain tumor - in both asthma and with the brain tumor there was a definite visible improvement at around the 12 hour mark with further improvement over the next few days.

Hope this helps - and I'll go PM Cheryl.

Alison

Hi Gina,
I just read your story from start to finish. Wow, you and Lucy have been through a lot the past few days!

My dog Barney had a couple of MRI's. Unfortunately it is really hard to tell how long the anesthesia will hang around for, as it depends on what they used an every Doc has their own preferences.

I know for Barney they used Propofol. It doesn't hang around long at all. I am an ICU nurse and we use it at work to sedate people who are on ventilators. They can be completely awake within a few minutes. (2 or 3 minutes they are stirring, within 10 minutes they are completely awake)
Some anesthetics need to be "reversed" (another medication is given that completely stops the action of the anesthesia) and alot of times they may use a narcotic in conjunction with a sedative.
Too many variables to even venture a guess, but if I had to guess, I would say propofol.

But.......
I am wondering if what you are seeing is the effects of the anesthesia or if it is just the effects of the macrotumor combined with Lucy having a really stressful day. If my dog is at the vets all day he comes home absolutely exhausted. Plus Lucy was sick before she went there with diarrhea as well as the neuro symptoms from the tumor. (I would almost bet that is what you are seeing with Lucy's back)
The effects of anesthesia are usually lethargy and respiratory depression. She is up and moving and breathing ok, but just sleepy, I would give it more time. If she was unarousable with slow shallow breathing then I would worry.
Also......
Careful what you are feeding Lucy. I gave BArney pancreatitis by feeding him fatty foods when trying to gets meds in him.
I know its hard to see them not eating, but if there is a reason she isn't eating, trying too hard to feed her could make things worse.

Its so hard to see them like this :(

Hope things are getting better as the pred helps with the neuro signs.

PS.........
I think you are a wonderful mom and you and Lucy are in my prayers.
Try to get some sleep!

Cheryl

Hi Gina,
Sorry it's so late. The pred may be being used to ease the swelling so it could take a little while before you see any neurological improvements. It may also increase her appetite slightly, but more than likely you will definitely notice an increase in water consumption, resulting in.....yep increased peeing. But that is a small price if it is helping. I hope that she is doing a little better by now. Keep the faith.

Fingers & toes crossed that Dr B has good news for you tomorrow.

Continued healing thoughts and prayers for Lucy.

~ Mary Ann

Nothing to add, just that I hope that you and Lucy have a good night sleep.

I think Cheryl is giving you great guiding points. The hydration I think is most important than the feeding. Although Tramadol is the best option for our cushings dogs for pain management it makes them quite groogy and weak on their hind legs. My dog was on Tramadol for 3-4 days (can't remember well) and I had to help her move and stand up while on it.

Will be praying for you.

Marcela & The Choco Labs

Alison, Cheryl, Mary Ann and Marcela....thank you so much! I was getting worried that the prednisone wasn't working. I'll just be patient. And you're right about the food, too....I think that's what happened with the diarrhea...I was so thrilled she was eating, I didn't care what it was.

Thanks for the thoughts and prayers, everyone. You guys are like my lifeline at this point:)

Gina and Lucy

Hi Gina,

Just dropping in to let you know we are pulling for you and your Lucygoo. Be positive and strong for her, I really feel that they can sense our stress. Keeping good thoughts and prayers.

John (Roxee's Dad)

I hope you got some rest. It is so hard to just "wait" for things to get better when you see your pet suffering.

Hope Lucy's feeling better today.


Cheryl

Dear Gina,

Just wanted you to know that I've also been following all that you and Lucy have been going through these last couple of days. Everyone has given you such great advice and support. I can only "second" what has already been said. I do so hope that the surgery remains a viable option for Lucy. But whatever happens, we'll be here for you both!!!

With (((hugs))) and hopeful wishes,
Marianne

Hi Gina,

I hope Lucy is feeling better today and that you are too!!! I know this is a very difficult time for you girls and we are truly hoping you get the surgical option. You are remarkable and doing all you can...and that is what you need to remember. Hang in there and keep up the fabulous and supportive job you are doing.

with best wishes and prayers,
Dorothy and Mikey

Thanks again everyone...Lucy seems much better this morning:)...she even had a few bites of food...voluntarily! And I was able to get some sleep last night, thanks to you guys. I felt like I didn't have to keep one eye open, making sure she was still breathing kind of thing. I think I'm going to skip the tramadol today...see how she does. I would think the prednisone would be enough.

Will keep you posted...

Gina and Lucy

Hi Gina,

Sending you and Goo prayers, healing thoughts, and hugs,
Leslie and the girls

Gina
Nike weighs about 85 lbs and her vet told me I can give her 125 mg ( 2.5 tabs) 2 times per day for pain, she has had bilat ACL repair and is old so has arthritis. I had just been giving her 1 tab, 2 times per day. one day she looked like she was hurting so I gave her 100 mg, only 2 tabs and later that morning I was getting ready to take her to the vets, she would hardly respond to me, difficult for me to wake her up, her gait was wobbly then I remember I gave her the 100 mg of tramadol and she was stoned. No more, now she will only get 100 mg when we are going to bed and she looks like she is hurting, and 1.5 during the day.
The pred is an antiinflamatory so will take down swelling but will do nothing for pain, I would talk to the vet about cutting back on the dose of the tramadol but not sure if I would stop it entirely, would hate to see your dog in pain.
Sharon

Just heard from Dr. Bruyette. He said all the surgeons agreed to do the surgery.....Yah!!!! I've been an absolute weirdo all day waiting to hear. They've scheduled it for Wednesday, so a week from today. I have to go in on Monday and meet the surgeons and sign the forms, blah, blah, blah. He told me they've done this surgery before on humans, and 30 cadaver dogs. Lucy will be the first live dog. So I have a week to hang in there with my Goo.

I was thanking Dr. Bruyette, and telling him how fortunate I felt to live in Los Angeles at this time, where they happen to be doing this, and he said he was thinking the same thing; like the planets were in alignment or something. He said he had just finished drafting the letter that he was sending out to vets around the country about this, (looking for 10-15 dogs), and in walks me with the perfect candidate. I also asked him if he thought I was doing the right thing. He said even taking money out of the picture, radiation wouldn't work because of the size of her tumor, not to mention the side effects.

So their goal is to get all the tumor out...he said even if they only get 80 percent out it's great. (which also made me feel better, that they're not just going to aggressively go after everything no matter what)

I'm still going to be on here constantly nagging you guys for advice, because it's a long road to Wednesday, so hang in there with me;)....

Thanks so much....

Love, Gina and Lucy

Gina,

This is such fantastic news. I too believe in fate. We will all be learning from this and thank you for sharing it with us. I will do the only thing I can for you and that is say lots of prayers and send warm vibes from my home to yours.

The best,
Kim

Hi Gina,

I'm so happy to hear that the surgery is an option for Lucy (and You )..We will be anxiously waiting and praying for the two of you!!! You are definitely doing the right thing.

with love and prayers...
Dorothy and Mikey

Gina,
I am sure you will be sleeping better tonight.
The planets aligned and God was smiling!!!
Give Lucy big hugs.
Continued healing thoughts and prayers for Lucy.
~ Mary Ann

Glad to hear that Lucy is doing better. Hope you and her are having a better sleep night tonight. We will be with you before, during and after next wednesday.

Marcela & the Choco Labs

WOW!!!! Oh Gina, your news brings tears to my eyes, because I know how grateful (and also scared) I would have felt had this option been available for my Barkis. I cannot tell you how much I hope this works PERFECTLY for your LucyGoo.

I will be holding you both in my heart, and anxiously awaiting next Wednesday!
Marianne

Hi all...me again checking in. I know I sound like a complete crazy person right now, but do you think it's normal for Lucy to be sleeping most of the time? I haven't given her a tramadol today, but she's like in a dazed state most of the time. Her spasms (or whatever they are) seem to have decreased in frequency and intensity, but she seems more confused and listless than ever. I keep telling myself that she just needs to rest, and to calm down. She doesn't seem like she's in pain, but should I give her a tramadol anyway?

I'm just hoping she holds out for next wednesday.

Thanks for helping....
Gina and Lucy