Interpreting dog

[BestBuddy]

Luke seems to be doing ok at dog school but there is always a hesitation when given a command to to something.

It usually goes like this..command....pause..... then sometimes he does it and sometimes not.

Several thoughts that may be going through his head...

I know what you want but what's wrong with what I am doing now?
I'm not going to drop, the grass is wet and cold!
If I do it, what's in it for me?

Jenny

[Roxee's Dad]

Sounds like Luke is pretty smart!


I know what you want but what's wrong with what I am doing now?
I'm not going to drop, the grass is wet and cold!
If I do it, what's in it for me?

Isn't this the way most of us think? :D

[StarDeb55]

Jenny, LOL!!;):D My mom used to be able to read our dogs like they were human kids talking, & do exactly what they needed or wanted to do. I'd stand their dumbstruck, "How did you know that?", I'd ask. Her response was always, "Don't you know how to interpret dog?":rolleyes:;)

Debbie

[AlisonandMia]

Once when I was at the dog park I was giving a treat to someone else's dog. He's a very well trained dog and always has to sit for a treat, so I asked him to "sit". He looked at me, then looked at his mum as if to say "Is it OK if I sit for her?" She just nodded to him and he sat with a big grin on his face that said "You can gimme the treat now!"

Alison

[SasAndYunah]

I'm not quite sure what Luke's age is, but could it be he's at "that age"? :D Is it only when he has to do a drop on the wet grass? Because there are in fact dogs who really dislike wet grass. Or it could be another dog has peed on that spot... some dogs wont drop where another dog has peed...:p

But if this happens with other commands as well, and thus isn't related to wet grass exclusively, it sounds more like Luke isn't too convinced you're the true packleader so he can obey at his own convenience and time :)

I have no idea if this is the case or not but there's a nice example in my own circle of friends. This is a couple with no children and they have a mixed breed dog. When out on walks, this dog dictates the walk :D Wich direction he wants to go to, where he wants to stop and sniff and for how long and he will lunge at every other dog he encounters. They don't understand why the dog behaves this way because they are doing everything right, as tought at the dogschool. And that may be the case but....at home, this dog runs the show. He eats with them at the diningtable from his own plate, sleeps where ever he wants, etc. Then, when they go for a walk, they want to take control of the dog but logically, the dog "disagrees", thinking..."hey, I am the packleader at home so why on earth would you think I would even remotely listen to you now?"

This is an extreme example but the moral of this example is that if you're not a true packleader at all times, you cannot expect the dog to obey at all times :) It also depends on the dogs character of course...some need more firm leadership with no exceptions at all, others will do fine with a bit of "spoiling" at home but will still obey outdoors.

So it could be that you just need to be a bit more of a packleader in other situations as well, to get Luke to obay outdoors :)

Again, I don't know the exact situation, so I do not know if this is the case here...just a possibility :)

Saskia and Yunah :)

[AlisonandMia]

I've noticed some dogs are very reluctant to drop in the presence of other dogs if the other dogs make them nervous. I guess they are afraid of being jumped on or maybe giving some doggy signal that they don't want to give in the company in which they find themselves.

Alison

[BestBuddy]

Thanks Sas,
I am sure part of it is my not being the packleader. Luke does have rules and he will obey me but hubby has more control. I also think that age could be a factor too because Luke is approaching the terrible twos. We have had him 6 months and have no idea on his life before. He does want to please me but has such a short attention span. I am waiting for a doggie DNA test to come in the mail so we can find out a bit about his heritage. It might not help to know but it is a bit of fun to find out. My guess is Poodle/Italian greyhound and maybe some others in the not too distant past.:D
Jenny

PS Alison you may have something there because we have to be on the end of the line before he will drop or I have no hope at all. It does seem like he doesn't want to show weakness with the others.

[AlisonandMia]

If he's been in a multi-dog rescue situation he may well have been on the receiving end of some pretty out-of-control, boisterous behavior, possibly from much larger dogs. That could make him even more nervous about it than he ordinarily be.

Alison

[k9diabetes]

When we were in obedience school, we were asked to bring $50 treats - what to Luke would be like a $50 gift to you?

Jack is totally food oriented so we use a semi-moist dog food that's not the healthiest as a food overall but is better than actual treats - Natural Balance rolls - like a sausage - that we cut up into small pieces. We can cut them any size we want, which is nice too.

There are a number of things for Jack for which NO treat is better - squirrels and rabbits mainly. And some things he can be yanked back from but a treat wouldn't stop him from going in the first place, like the Jack Russell terriers next door.

Sophia has mentioned with her own challenging dog that she uses commands that require him to be in a vulnerable position to determine how relaxed and comfortable he is in a situation. If he's not comfortable, he won't go into those vulnerable positions.

Boy do I understand short attention span!! If it's not on a squirrel, that is. When it comes to squirrels, Jack is totally focused! ;)

Sophia Yin has many videos you can watch at her website - maybe they will give you some ideas. www.aksdryin.com (http://www.aksdryin.com).

Natalie

[BestBuddy]

I'll check out those videos and hopefully get some ideas.
Luke has been more ditsy the last two weeks and the only difference is that we have been allowed to take them over the agility course (on lead of course) and he just loves it. We have to go first because he is so fast that he catches all the other dogs because they hesitate and he just goes for it. The trouble is that when we then get back to the basics Luke is fixated on the course and just won't concentrate. He just watches all the other dogs on the agility course and cries. The only trouble is that to be allowed to do the course properly he has to be controllable off lead and I am not sure that will ever happen.

As for treats, this week I took small pieces of cooked chicken breast and he seemed to absolutely love it. I am still coming to terms with giving treats while training as when I took Nelson (oh so many years ago) it was all done with praise and the fact that Nelson was a star makes the contrast between dogs so much greater.

Jenny

[k9diabetes]

Jack really couldn't care less about praise! If that's all we had to work with, we would still be at square one. Some dogs do like other things better - a toy to play with or praise and petting. Jack's not a big fan of being petted. But he does love almost anything edible. He'll perform pretty well for his kibble.

After Luke runs the agility course, do you find him harder to manage at home?

I ask because we have seen this with Jack. Anything that gets him very aroused ramps him up for a long period of time. And once one thing ramps him up, he carries that energy over to other things. His problems with people have often followed a problem with an inanimate object, like the motorized kite whirling around over his head.

And the same thing tends to happen even when it's a good thing that has him excited. The excited state remains after.

One of our tasks the past couple of weeks has been to absolutely not tolerate any of his aroused behavior. Sometimes that means trailing a leash, which seems to improve his behavior plus allows us to stop him from doing some things, and sometimes that means putting him into a down stay and keeping him there for a while. Sophia noticed while she was here that Jack was pacing and she wanted us to stop anything antsy like that. Keep bringing him back to calm behavior with no rewards at all for aroused behavior. I do think that's helping him get better control of himself.

The whole time she was taking down information, she had him in a down stay. He kept popping up, of course, but she just put him back to it and even put a foot on his leash so he couldn't wander off.

I wonder if a pretty high energy level is part of it. Jack's energy level, or stamina at least, is actually not a big deal. He gets tired pretty quickly. But mental stimulation is the big thing for him. A car ride could almost replace a walk and he'd be just as happy. A car ride and a walk and he's a happy camper.

Sophia's book, How to Behave So Your Dog Behaves, is also good. And I recently came upon some audio training advice that I thought was good...

http://smarterpodcasts.com/gooddog/gooddog.html.

Reading about it and watching it helps me... doesn't completely teach me how to do it - I don't think we'd have gotten as far as we have without a trainer working directly with us. But I like understanding the theory behind what I'm trying to do - that makes it easier for me to know what to do if I know why.

Natalie

[forscooter]

Bailey and Scoobie were always boys of few words...they only had three phrases:

I want to eat.

I want to go outside.

I'm not doing that.

LOL, good luck with the training, Jenny...I am sure you will get there! You have way more patience than I do!!

Love ya! Beth and the boys

[ventilate]

Jenny;
I agree with Natalie about the dog being calm. My man;):D Ceasar says as well they have tobe in a calm submissive state before doing anything if they are excited it just dont work. Nike and Kenai have been though many classes, Nike is mostly always calm. Kenai on the other hand is not, I have to walk him around a bit and settle hm down a lot before getting him to do some exercises.
I also used a clicker. it is a lot faster than your reaction with voice can be, you click as soon as the dog does what you want then treat. my dogs are both food hounds. I would get yummie chummies which are salmon treats and they would dance a jig if I asked them to for those:p well almost.
Good luck with the training.
Sharon

[k9diabetes]

Also, instead of a clicker, you can set up a bridge word so that you don't have to carry a clicker. We use "good" in a very animated voice. We started out saying it and giving him a treat right away until he knows that word means he gets a treat.

Then you can use the word and follow at a more leisurely pace with the treat. It is much easier to say a word than to get a treat down right away.

Sophia has a great video where she uses a word to tell her dog s/he's done the right thing when shaping a behavior. (Of course, this dog knows s/he's being trained and to look for the right behavior - but the concept is the same). She says the word when she gets the behavior she wants and then the dog comes to get her treat in response to the approval word.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0XuafyPwkg&feature=channel_page

I couldn't get to the main dog movies in askdryin.com - I know she's doing some rearranging... but it is available at her YouTube page.

Natalie

[BestBuddy]

I have a clicker but I am not coordinated enough to use it at the right time and it always seems to be somewhere else other than with me when I need it.:D Our animated word is "yes" but I seem to say no a lot more.:o

Sharon, you have to share Cesar now because we get the shows here and I even went to see him live a few months ago.;) I do the no touch no talk no eye contact when I come home so that I am not "greeted" to death and it seems to be slowly working.

I seem to be doing a combo of training methods so maybe I am confusing him.

Jenny

[BestBuddy]

Sunday was promotion day and guess what.....we failed. Neither Luke or Joey were good enough to pass. Joey didn't start classes for 7 weeks after Luke so he is naturally a little further behind.

Luke did everything he was asked except drop, he just would not lay down on the wet grass. It was a cold day and the wind was freezing and it was raining so it wasn't the perfect day to be testing.

Oh well, next promotion day is now in December so we will have to do some more practice and hopefully because our summer should be in full swing the grass will be dry.:o

Luke's DNA test came back and surprise to us all his main breeds are poodle shiba inu.:confused: He did not have primary breeds listed as is seems none of his immediate relatives were pure bred so the poodle/shiba mix came in as secondary. He did not even have distant other breeds listed which could mean he is so mixed up that nothing was strong enough to register or.....the breeds are not on the labs data base.:eek:

Jenny

[Barney's Mom]

Sunday was promotion day and guess what.....we failed. Neither Luke or Joey were good enough to pass. Joey didn't start classes for 7 weeks after Luke so he is naturally a little further behind.

Luke did everything he was asked except drop, he just would not lay down on the wet grass. It was a cold day and the wind was freezing and it was raining so it wasn't the perfect day to be testing.

Oh well, next promotion day is now in December so we will have to do some more practice and hopefully because our summer should be in full swing the grass will be dry.:o

Luke's DNA test came back and surprise to us all his main breeds are poodle shiba inu.:confused: He did not have primary breeds listed as is seems none of his immediate relatives were pure bred so the poodle/shiba mix came in as secondary. He did not even have distant other breeds listed which could mean he is so mixed up that nothing was strong enough to register or.....the breeds are not on the labs data base.:eek:

Jenny

:( poor Jenny! Both your kids fail school and you find out Luke is a purebred mutt. My mutts have been the healthiest and the happiest dogs I have owned.
Sounds like Luke will get there very soon, and Joey still has lots of time to learn.
I think I will have to try Cesar's method to avoid being greeted to death as well!

Cheryl

[k9diabetes]

My goodness - I had no idea they were so demanding!! I'll bet they wouldn't want to get belly down in the cold wet grass either!

We didn't have a test at the end of our class - we had a party! There were some games and Jack won a prize! And then each dog got a toy as a graduation present... :) I say that's more like it!

Natalie

[BestBuddy]

I knew from the start that Luke was a mutt but didn't know what sort of mutt/s were involved.:D

I thought it was a bit mean to have the testing on a cold wet day but there were some dogs that actually passed (about 12 out of 100) and I met a man who was doing the test for the 3rd time and looks like he will be joining us again next time.:eek:

If they had a subsection on toys in the class I am sure Luke would have passed with flying colors.

Jenny