Advice for Boston Terrier

[K1992]

Hello Everyone-

I was hoping to get some advice from you all who have experienced Cushing's disease in their beloved pets.

About a month and a half ago we became very worried about our Boston Terriers extreme intake of water, urination, and pot belly. She has had a pot belly for some time though, we chalked it up to being overweight. She also has had missing hair on her tail since we adopted her 5 years ago (her tail was never docked), though, when it became more bald, it didn't really strike us since it was always balding. Though, when the other symptoms came up and her belly seemed very hard to the touch, we got her in quickly.

The vet took her blood, a urine sample, and x rays. Her urine sample came back with an extremely low gravity, close to water (if I am saying that correctly), and her blood work came back abnormal. We suggested to him that we thought it was Cushings, due to her water intake, urination, pot belly, extreme tiredness, loss of hair.... He did not think it was Cushings, but didn't have much of an answer at all. He was however, worried about the shadow he saw on her heart and suggested we take her to a cardiologist. The vet also prescribed her to prednisone, as he discovered she is likely older than we thought due to her "ancient back." He thought she might be in pain going potty, and may have a "backup" in her belly. In later research, we learned that prednisone is terrible for her if Cushings is the case.

Upon our visit to the cardiologist (pre-scan), the Dr. began by telling us that all signs pointed to congestive heart failure. Heartbroken, waiting for her to come back from her scan, we were RELIEVED to find out that her heart was healthy.

As a follow-up call from our first vet, he said "we might be onto something with the Cushings." We are very certain based on all symptoms and all research we've done that she does have this.

After doing a lot of research on Cushings, it sounds that the medical treatments are very tough on the dog, and do not cure/could not even work with symptoms. Has anyone experienced, or have any feedback? We do not want to put her through misery.

We've started on the Cushex holistic drops, but haven't seen any results in the last few weeks. Has anyone tried these? Feedback?

The most heartbreaking of all, the last few weeks she seems to have declined so rapidly. She no longer seems to be our same little girl She sleeps nonstop, can no longer walk down the stairs except an occasional step or two, and seems so much more distant. She was always lazy, but was a snuggly, ball of joy. It also seems like her neck is locked, and she can't look up.

We're just not sure how to move forward or what to do. We of course want to do everything we can to make her comfortable and happy, but are stuck at what to do next.

If anyone has any advice, it would be wonderful to hear. Thank you so much.

[labblab]

Hello and welcome! I apologize that I have only a moment to post right now, but I wanted to let you know that I've moved your thread here, to our main Questions and Discussion forum. This way, more folks are likely to see it and have the opportunity to offer their thoughts.

I'm so sorry about your girl's problems, but very glad you've found us!

Marianne

[lulusmom]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

I am so sorry to hear that your precious girl is having such a tough time of things right now. We've had many members who have used Cushex Drops and some with milder symptoms seem to see improvements but what we've discovered is that if a dog has overt symptoms, it's highly unlikely that any improvement will be seen. I personally contacted the company and asked if they conducted clinical trials that proved the safety and efficacy of their product via appropriate cortisol testing such as the UC:CR, ACTH stimulation test and low dose dexamethasone suppression test. Their answer was no and that they rely on anecdotal evidence by way of customer reviews. The good news is that we've not heard of any dogs having bad reactions to Cushex Drops or any of the other online remedies.

There are horror stories on the internet about the two conventional drugs, Vetoryl (trilostane) and Lysodren (mitotane) that are truly effective and unfortunately some general practice vets echo those horror stories. That's usually a red flag that those vets have little experience with the disease or its treatments. We've had thousands of members successfully treat their dogs with these two drugs. Do all dogs stabilize on treatment without side effects? Not all but what we've learned from experience is that the trail of responsibility for the vast number of dogs who do experience side effects usually leads back to an inexperienced vet who did not follow proper dosing and treatment monitoring protocol. I've administered treatment of both drugs to multiple dogs, two of my own and two shelter rescues, all of whom stabilized with no side effects. My two tiny cushdogs lead a great quality of life for several years after treatment and their success stories can be repeated by many of our members.

Boston Terrier is a breed that seems to be over-represented in canine cushing's and being a brachycephalic (short snouted) breed, they also seem to be more predisposed to enlarging pituitary macroadenomas. Does your girl have pituitary or adrenal cushing's? Dogs with cushing's do become lethargic and seem to withdraw from social interaction so that is not uncommon. However, if a dog is also staring off into space, circling and head pressing, that would be a pretty good indication of neurological signs seen in dogs with expanding macro tumors. Does any of that sound familiar?

The key to facilitating safe and effective treatment is an educated pet owner and an experienced vet. When either of those are missing is when a dog is more vulnerable to adverse reactions. We can help you learn so that you can become a knowledgeable and proactive participant in your pup's care. The more information you can provide about your girl's history, the easier it will be for us to provide appropriate feedback and reference material. I do remember my own experience and how terrified I was when my first dog was diagnosed with cushing's. She was only three years old so declining treatment was not an option. I was like a deer in headlights and had no idea how I was going to get my girl through what I thought was going to be a life threatening experience. My worst fears never came to fruition...not even close. I learned that knowledge is power and with greater understanding of things, my stress level dropped by leaps and bounds.

It would be most helpful if you could round up copies of all testing that your vet did to confirm the diagnosis. We would be interested in seeing the high and low values on the blood labs, and please include the normal reference ranges. Can you also share the results of the any urinalysis and diagnostic tests, such as the acth stimulation test, uc:cr and/or low dose dexamethasone suppression (LDDS) test. Did either the cardiologist or your gp vet order an abdominal ultrasound? If so, can you please share the results? I apologize for asking so much of you but as I said, the more information, the better.

I'm sure others will be by to welcome you and share their own experience and ask any questions I may have forgotten. We're all very sorry for the reasons that brought you here but we're very glad you found us. We're a great bunch of hand holders and staunch advocates for every dog who walks through our door so we will do whatever we can to help both of you on this journey.

Glynda

[DoxieMama]

Hello and welcome from me, too. Those test results Glynda mentioned will be very helpful for those knowledgeable folks here. Have you been giving her the prednisone?

I'm so sorry that your girl is feeling so poorly, but we now stand beside you as you determine the best actions to take to help her feel better.

Shana

[judymaggie]

Hi and welcome to you and your pup (name?)! Glynda has skillfully covered all the Cushing's issues. I wanted to address your comment "it also seems like her neck is locked, and she can't look up." My Cushing's beagle has intervertebral disk disease (IVDD) and had surgical treatment for a ruptured disk in her neck last year so I am particularly sensitive to problems in this area. I am certainly not saying that your dog has similar problems but I do think that you should address this with your vet and, if necessary, with a neurologist. If she is in pain from a neck issue, this could account for some of her symptoms.

Looking forward to learning more about your dog!

[molly muffin]

Hi and welcome from me too. Glynda has gotten you off to a good start and there is nothing that I can add to what she wrote.

If you could go through and answer some of her questions that would enable us to give you better feedback.

Judy made a good point about the neck/back issue. Have they ever done an xray to look at her discs?

[K1992]

Hello All-

Thank you so so much for taking the time to post your thoughtful feedback. I do greatly appreciate it.

Answering a few questions from the few posts:

I hate to sound like a crazy, self-diagnoser but I am unsure of the type of Cushing's, as the vet had not diagnosed specifically. Through the mounds of research my boyfriend and I have done, her symptoms are verbatim. It seems it would be in our best interest to seek out another vet, as when we initially took her in (pre-tests) he had said that he didn't think it was Cushing's and a big belly was not even a symptom (of course, not the case). He also mentioned most people do not treat it. It wasn't until after the tests came back and we visited the cardiologist that he said we might be onto something with the Cushing's. Which with those comments, you could imagine we weren't particularly giving him our vote of confidence. I hope that does not discredit my comments!

If anyone has heard of great Dr.'s in the MI area (not sure where you're all located), that would be helpful.

Mabel's head does seem pressed and she does stare off into space, but she is not circling. This symptom started very recently. I hate to jump to this even, but we did initially think it seemed stroke-like.

I will get the urine, blood, x rays, and heart scan and post them here soon. We have not done an ab scan as of yet.

We did stop giving her the prednisone after we discovered it was not in her best interest, but she did almost finish her 20 pills before we reached that knowledge.

Thank you for the thoughts on IVDD, I didn't consider since it is such a new symptom.

Lastly, she did get xrays when we first took her to the vet. Going in we had thought she was about 6 years old (adopted), but the vet said her back was very arthritic, likely leading to him think she was older than we thought (reason for prednisone). He hadn't mentioned anything about slipped discs, but I assume I am unsure if that might require a more specialized xray?

Again, thank you so much for your feedback! Will get the results posted shortly.

[Harley PoMMom]

When a dog is receiving prednisone for a period of time it can create the same symptoms of a dog with spontaneous Cushing's. So since you have stopped the prednisone this may make Mabel's symptoms dissipate.

With regards to the head pressing, high blood pressure can cause this, has her blood pressure been checked?

Lori

[lulusmom]

I agree with Lori; however, if your girl were to have a large pituitary macroadenoma or other brain tumor that was compressing enough to cause neurological signs, prednisone would be helpful in alleviating some of those signs. If your girl was head pressing you would know it. A dog will stand against any hard object and press their head into it. Is that what you saw? Since withdrawing her off of prednisone, have you noticed any worsening of symptoms?

[molly muffin]

Did you notice any difference in the head pressing, or any other neurological symptoms when she was on the prednisone?